Ukraine standoff intensifies, Russia says sanctions will 'boomerang'

Comments (143)
Gabrielgv wrote:

I agree with the Referendum…we are in a new century where people can choose what they want to be with. If the majority of Crimea want`s to be Russian…why not?

Mar 06, 2014 7:55pm EST  --  Report as abuse
glenjo1 wrote:

So let them go. While slightly different(okay very!) what if California voted to become two states. That obviously has Federal implications(i.e. 2 extra Senators, etc.), but basically is a similar premise. I know this isn’t the same, but honestly if the Crimea people want to rejoin Russia who they are more aligned with I don’t see the huge issue. I know I have oversimplified, but some level of isolationism on the US;s side is good.

Mar 06, 2014 8:14pm EST  --  Report as abuse
74LS08 wrote:

Why does US have to make loans to Ukraine??

EU has 500 million citizens, and 4 of EU members have borders with Ukraine. Let them worry about the situation.

Action of our government defy any logic other than a desire to stoke up a conflict with Russia.

Mar 06, 2014 8:24pm EST  --  Report as abuse
dkbaz wrote:

Now the US has another arch-enemy, so that more unnecessary US military spending can be justified. The Muslim-Alqueda-terrorist thing was getting worn out, so now we can start another cold war with Russia. Perpetual war for perpetual peace.

Mar 06, 2014 8:27pm EST  --  Report as abuse
scott1357 wrote:

My memory of African state names is poor, but was it Somalia, Eritrea, or ? which split into North and South (Muslim and Christian) with Western AND US support in the last year or two?

So Crimea splitting is illegal; please don’t make me laugh while eating. The Western nations, and the US in particular, are such hypocrites…

Mar 06, 2014 8:42pm EST  --  Report as abuse
WinterRED wrote:

As a Canadian I’ve been hearing rumours abound that Quebec will be holding a referendum for separation as well. Although it would be silly of me to suggest that the two are the same, they do have their similarities.

My question is, if the pro-western governments see the Crimea referendum as illegal, would the Quebec one also be illegal? And if it is technically “illegal” would the US government still take the same hardline stance against a place much closer to home (both geographically and politically.)

Mar 06, 2014 8:45pm EST  --  Report as abuse
RandomName2nd wrote:

NOW the US government cares about International law.
Seemed they didn’t care one iota during the Iraq and Afghanistan invasions.
But then if there was ever one word that described the US government it would undoubtedly be “hypocrite”.

Mar 06, 2014 8:46pm EST  --  Report as abuse
kommy wrote:

Gone, baby gone! Kudos to Crimeans for standing up to Nazi power in Kiev.

Mar 06, 2014 8:46pm EST  --  Report as abuse
StanleyFox wrote:

Mr Putin, or rather Putler (correct name for the political mafioso) is striving to grab the gas & oil shelf around Crimea. The military base, gas pipeline & black soil of Ukraine are evidently less important for this Hitler’s clone. Not to mention common people on both sides – they are merely the gun- & PR-meat, as usual. Putler’s new gal inquired about her gift on March 8th. “Is Crimea OK?”, asked the dwarf)
How about writing off the huge foreign debt of Ukraine? The precedence was Poland 50% off while joining EU, Greece 85% off the debt, and without any mass killings, no fight for EU democracy in those lucky countries.

Mar 06, 2014 8:52pm EST  --  Report as abuse
f00 wrote:

“Nazis” aren’t in power anywhere. The new Uke PM is a Jew, their President is a Baptist Zionist nutjob, and Praviy Sektor has already made nice nice with the Israelis.

The Russians seem to be using the “Nazi” canard because the memories of WWII still evoke deep nationalist sentiment. It’s hard to believe that after 70 years of Judeo-Communism, preceded by centuries of living with the tribe, the Russians can’t recognize Jewish handiwork when they see it.

Mar 06, 2014 9:06pm EST  --  Report as abuse
pyanitsa wrote:

The new Ukrainian regime has just announced one of the conditions of the EU $15 Billion bail out: Starting next month pensions will be cut by half.

Mar 06, 2014 9:14pm EST  --  Report as abuse
Prox wrote:

If Putin wants to protect the Russians in Ukraine and the Russians want to live under Russian rule,, why doesn’t he just relocate them to Russia.

Mar 06, 2014 9:16pm EST  --  Report as abuse
Fromkin wrote:

“Obama outlined the terms of a diplomatic “off-ramp” that U.S. officials are promoting, in which Russia would pull back troops to bases in Crimea, allow in international monitors to ensure the rights of ethnic Russians are respected and consent to direct talks with Ukraine officials.”

This amounts to offering nothing. We can’t rely on propaganda reports. But if it’s true that this is what Obama offered, then we’re far from a settlement solution.

What is needed is a true transitional government representing the interests of all Ukrainians.

Until a real government is formed, Russia should not talk to the Skinheads the US puts in power by force

Mar 06, 2014 9:44pm EST  --  Report as abuse
MooseDr wrote:

It seems that the free world is saying to Crimea, “you are a democracy so you can’t decide things by voting.”

Scotland is in the process of doing something similar. Quebec has had two referendums to split from Canada. There is plenty of president for a region of a country to have a secession referendum. If they vote to split, then some negotiations have to happen, like how is the debt shared.

Further, Crimea is not a region deeply rooted in Ukrainian history. They were tacked on by Khrushchev. They should well be able to revisit their place on the map.

Mar 06, 2014 9:47pm EST  --  Report as abuse

The headline is inaccurate. They did not vote to “join Russia” they voted to hold an election. Whether or not it will be an honest election and therefore valid remains to be seen – I doubt it.

Mar 06, 2014 10:42pm EST  --  Report as abuse

The headline is inaccurate. They did not vote to “join Russia” they voted to hold an election. Whether or not it will be an honest election and therefore valid remains to be seen – I doubt it.

Mar 06, 2014 10:42pm EST  --  Report as abuse
jrpardinas wrote:

Obama and his State Department have a pair!

They send in John McCain to rile some Ukrainian Bozos in Kiev and they think they can just walk away with a piece of Russia.

For there’s no denying that the Crimea is Russia. It’s been Russia through multiple Western European genocidal invasions; from Napoleon to the Nazis.

For the would-be masters of the Universe in Washington to think they can just waltz in and sever those centuries-old ties of blood, shared suffering and history using as pretext a bunch of hired goons in Kiev is ludicrous beyond belief.

Mar 06, 2014 11:09pm EST  --  Report as abuse
dkbaz wrote:

When the War on Terror and the Muslim terrorist threat become boring and not newsworthy, we have created a new enemy. Cold War II will allow the US to justify a huge arms buildup and more military aggression. Let’s hope that it doesn’t escalate and stumble into WW III.

Mar 06, 2014 11:10pm EST  --  Report as abuse
ProEto wrote:

US will pay a billion to Ukraine. EU will pay EUR 11 billion to Ukraine. Putin will have Crimea, doesn’t have to bail out Ukraine with his 15 billion, will stop paying for the base in Sebastopol and doesn’t have to discount nat. gas. Ukraine owes Gazprom 1.5 billion so the American check comes handy. Are these people insane, what is wrong with them? Their answer: send some planes to Poland…. And they say Putin lost his marbles.

Mar 06, 2014 11:30pm EST  --  Report as abuse
Verpoly wrote:

Can’t hold laughing. Ukraine orders Crimean parliament to be dissolved. Who is listening to that and take instructions from Kiev when Ukrainian military even holed up in their facilities ?

Mar 06, 2014 11:35pm EST  --  Report as abuse
beerpatzer wrote:

Bravo Crimea!!! The most beautiful part of Ukraine is now officially Russian… Only warts, moles and boils remain on the body of modern Uraine…

Mar 07, 2014 12:26am EST  --  Report as abuse
Sonorama wrote:

@dkbaz

Perpetual war for perpetual profit.

Mar 07, 2014 1:10am EST  --  Report as abuse
UScitizentoo wrote:

Glory to the Heros. Death to the Occupiers. There will be war between Russia and Ukraine soon.

Mar 07, 2014 1:38am EST  --  Report as abuse
Isbahannur wrote:

Killing in indonesia
http://www.acehbaru.com/tni-terlibat-dalam-konflik-agraria-di-jambi-1-tewas-5-luka-parah/

Mar 07, 2014 3:08am EST  --  Report as abuse
Fromkin wrote:

@Uscitizentoo,”There will be war between Russia and Ukraine soon.”

Ukraine has even less of a chance than Georgia had in 2008. Which means the war will never start. But if the Skinheads backed by the West make bad moves they will lose more than just Crimea. Which means the whole eastern and southern parts will be gone. Too much wishful thinking. Calm dowm.

Mar 07, 2014 3:26am EST  --  Report as abuse

go!!!

Mar 07, 2014 3:34am EST  --  Report as abuse

http://news.rambler.ru/23985919/
Yarosh demanded that the government of Ukraine to open arsenals to militants “right sector”

Mar 07, 2014 3:38am EST  --  Report as abuse
gowintec wrote:

36 “The king will do as he pleases, and he will exalt himself and magnify himself above every god; and against the God of gods he will speak astonishing things. And he will prove successful until the denunciation comes to a finish; because what is determined must take place. 37 He will show no regard for the God of his fathers; nor will he show regard for the desire of women or for any other god, but he will magnify himself over everyone. 38 But instead he will give glory to the god of fortresses; to a god that his fathers did not know he will give glory by means of gold and silver and precious stones and desirable things. 39 He will act effectively against the most fortified strongholds, along with a foreign god. He will give great glory to those who give him recognition, and he will make them rule among many; and the ground he will apportion out for a price. 40 “In the time of the end the king of the south will engage with him in a pushing, and against him the king of the north will storm with chariots and horsemen and many ships; and he will enter into the lands and sweep through like a flood. And he will rule over the hidden treasures of gold and silver and over all the desirable things of Egypt. And the Lib′y·ans and the E·thi·o′pi·ans will be at his steps. 44 “But reports out of the east and out of the north will disturb him, and he will go out in a great rage to annihilate and to devote many to destruction. 45 And he will plant his royal tents between the grand sea and the holy mountain of Decoration; and he will come all the way to his end, and there will be no helper for him.Daniel 11, prophecy coming true.

Mar 07, 2014 4:50am EST  --  Report as abuse
rvm3 wrote:

The vote in the Crimean parliament was *unanimous.* But Reuters insists on adding loaded propaganda to this article. When the US invaded and occupied Iraq the tribal media was all for this, of course. As in Kosovo, a direct analogy to Crimea.

Mar 07, 2014 4:55am EST  --  Report as abuse
Dehumanist wrote:

So if Russian speakers in the US ask for Putin’s help he’ll come and aid them with military force too?

Mar 07, 2014 4:59am EST  --  Report as abuse
itsmysayokay wrote:

“Russia cannot ignore calls for help and it acts accordingly, in full compliance with international law,” Putin said.
Really? What a joke that is. This is not a good scene folks and there probably will be war breaking out! Putin is never to be trusted in the world body. Look how he keeps a terrorist Governor in Syria in power by abusing it’s veto power.

Mar 07, 2014 6:00am EST  --  Report as abuse
Hitchin wrote:

So far we can see that Russia wants to own Crimea. Does anyone believe in referendum under gun point?;)

Mar 07, 2014 6:30am EST  --  Report as abuse
Canela wrote:

Looks like Putin went to the Hitler school of intervention politics.

Mar 07, 2014 7:03am EST  --  Report as abuse
VALEKM wrote:

95% of crimeans want to separate themselves from the JUNTA in kiev, the pro-fascist illegal regeme.
That woman, 41 in Crimea no doubt does exist, but she would be balanced out by 100 women of 41 in Crimea, who think DIRECTLY OPPOSITE.
Whatever, roitres can bull*t the crowd along, but the REFERENDUM will tell us who is on the right side of history, the clowns or the Russians.

Mar 07, 2014 7:09am EST  --  Report as abuse
Gabrielgv wrote:

It is really funny! Few years ago… England claimed that the Falkland Islands should be british since the majority of the people in the island want to be part of the U.K.
And now they just go against the same situation. It`s seems that the majority wants to be Russian…

Mar 07, 2014 7:18am EST  --  Report as abuse
Bugzy wrote:

Putin is leading by a greater example than Obama! If you want to threaten and sanction Russia then do it broadly. Why sanction people close to Putin and not Putin himself. Always looking to freeze and still assets. Really disappointed in Obama……even Merkel is showing a more mature form of leadership. Obama is far more reasonable than John Kerry (he should start a rival tea party with McCain).
The WhiteHouse focus should be on Americans, gun control, economy, equality and sustainability.

Mar 07, 2014 7:47am EST  --  Report as abuse
ProEto wrote:

Got it. There are times when voice of the people is correct and thus legitimate and times when it isn’t . Depends if that hurts or benefits Russia or the US

Mar 07, 2014 8:01am EST  --  Report as abuse
yellowjap wrote:

“if California voted to become two states”, “Why does US have to make loans, (because EU have no interest to get sure loser)” I do believe that’s the heart of the problem. It’s second wave after Jewish community, after seeing success of Korean community, now US will face more minority community supporting rebels demands and lose both stability and foreign friends.
Better stay away, US lost too many trust and bought too many hate.
Not only China, now many will turn US asset to GBP-Euro based bonds. You actually seeing first process, making company to transfer these US asset.
London should be quite busy. Financial market price should be OK as they buy future while selling. But asset/debt rate and vacancy rate is too difficult to estimate. So, I just focus on SPAN dealing. As stupid power dealer from PLA is gone. It’s getting tough to earn day’s food. But we do have 5 century experience for future trade in closed world with all possible disasters. Today A50 was passed by NIF. NYSE is just west end of British empire, financial networks are still on that network both on and off account book.

Mar 07, 2014 8:05am EST  --  Report as abuse
engineer99 wrote:

I think USA should avoid making public statements that create the impression that USA is telling Russia what to do. This plays good to US audience, but NOT Russian audience.
It maks Putin do things that create the impression that Russia is powerful and does not care what the USA says. It hardens Putin’s attitude and makes him less likely to compromise so he will not appeared to have backed down, for the Russian audience.
You must allow both sides to SAVE FACES to defuse the crisis.

Mar 07, 2014 8:14am EST  --  Report as abuse
disengage wrote:

Well, seems like its all, but over. Obama, EU, will slap some sanctions here and there.Fly 5 or 6 planes here or there, move 1 destroyer, means nothing to Putin. He has looked into Obamas eyes, and seen a coward. Bye, Bye, Crimea, you are now a slave, of the new(but old) reconstituted soviet empire.You got your wish, now live with the results.

Mar 07, 2014 8:33am EST  --  Report as abuse
MrBlue wrote:

Negotiate….Compromise…..quit acting like children, because the choices you make may be the difference between whether your children live or die! Grow up!

Mar 07, 2014 8:35am EST  --  Report as abuse
Lesteer wrote:

Referendum?? It will be wrongdoing while armed Russian Pirates arround!! How possibly prepar legal voting one week in the circumstances??. Maybe Putin will sent ready votes from Russia??? Shock!. Adolf Hitler would be suprised!!!

Mar 07, 2014 8:59am EST  --  Report as abuse
tomrutter2006 wrote:

Great reporting Reuters. Tough to get the facts without bias commentary in most of the US major news outlets including the New York Times. Keep up the good work…much is at stake, very possibly War.

Tom Rutter
Denver CO

Mar 07, 2014 9:01am EST  --  Report as abuse
JustProduce wrote:

Putin reminds me of bond traders who hunt the opportunity and go in with everything when the window of opportunity opens. Incredible strategy.

Mar 07, 2014 9:18am EST  --  Report as abuse
NBE wrote:

I don’t understand why, if Crimea votes on something, it is for the rest of the world to accept the decision. Crimea did not have a say in whether, oh, for instance, Massachusetts did health care the way it did under Governor Romney. Bunch of other American states had opinions—whether this was a good example or not—but it was not for the other states to tell Massachusetts what to do, and it certainly wasn’t for half a world away to “recognize” the law or not. If California were to secede, I say it wouldn’t be for Russia or Ukraine or some peninsula belonging to either or disputed between them, to weigh in. American states might, and some might say we mustn’t allow such a thing and some others would say bye, but how this would be for overseas to forbid, I just don’t get. And California, has an economy bigger than most world states, and an agriculture that feeds much of the world. The corn and wheat states—elgl, Kansas—feed a lot of the world and U.S. too, but do not have the world-class economy that California does, so I used California as the example. I’m sorry if this sounds . . . too unscholarly for the company it is in, and I’m no scholar . . . but just an ordinary perplexed old person. I can see the present mess turning into a world war, but I cannot for the life of me see why it should. Whereas, I could and still do see why Germany’s taking Poland as an act of war. And I am glad the Allies eventually allied themselves and defeated the Axis. That said, I do not see Germany or Italy today as enemies—I speak as a second-generation American whose ancestors came from what is now called “Belarus” and so you know my ethnicity, too. My parents were leery of Germany their entire American lives; I am not. The world changes, it seems to me.

Mar 07, 2014 9:53am EST  --  Report as abuse
QuidProQuo wrote:

Why don’t we just cool our jets until the Crimean referendum vote happens? Then see how everything can be formed into a mutually beneficial solution for all. I personally do not see the need here for all this hyped up frenzy. Crimea is not even 4.5% of Ukraine’s total population. Russia has legal authority to have up to 25,000 troops in Crimea under a bilateral agreement. Turning this into a big global anxiety fest over an area that has 1/10 the population of the state of Ny is kind of really being a little over the top.

Mar 07, 2014 9:56am EST  --  Report as abuse
Rich_F wrote:

this all comes down to dollars people. while russia derives a sizable portion of its GDP from energy the EU and eastern european countries get a lion’s share of their energy from russia and that can’t change on a dime. you can already see germany backing off on economic sanctions because they’ll cut their own nose off to spite their face. US providing $2 billion in loan guarantees is a joke in that ukraine can burn through that very quickly heck ukraine already owes $15 billion to russia and gets discounts on their energy. how about russia stop those discounts?

the EU loan package of $15 billion is also highly unlikely since its up to each individual country on whether to back it and once again since the country is broke those loan amounts will also go quickly.

putin is right where he wants to be ukraine will collapse economically from the inside and russia will be there to pick up the pieces. whether they annex crimea or its russia in name only (like now) in any event crimea and eastern ukraine will continue to remain a colony of russia for the foreseeable future.

Mar 07, 2014 10:00am EST  --  Report as abuse
QuidProQuo wrote:

I know, weird huh that this is turning into some global frenzy? For a geographic area 1/10 the size of the state of NY there sure are a lot of outside antagonists on this one. There is a petition on the petitionsite.com that is seeking supporters of Crimeans independence from Ukraine if they so choose that route.
I don’t think Reuters approves of links here so just check out the petitition site dot com. click on the Care2 site logo and then I believe I clicked on browse petitions and in the search box typed
Crimea. I think it’s titled Independence for Crimea. Personally I have no desire to see any animosity over a peaceful annexation if that’s the way it all unfolds. You would thing the UN and all nations would be thrilled to see a peaceful annexation instead of a vicious unwanted annexation like the one regarding Golan Heights.

Mar 07, 2014 10:08am EST  --  Report as abuse
Rich_F wrote:

>>Why don’t we just cool our jets until the Crimean referendum vote happens?

this is a joke just like the parliament voting to cede to russia it’s all a fix with no oversight from anyone that would deem it fair. that’s besides the point as the intent to justify russian involvement in the ukraine plain and simple.

Mar 07, 2014 10:20am EST  --  Report as abuse
gowintec wrote:

This is a big deal, I keep reading how it was neo nazis that over running the Ukraine. However the pro Russian groups are the big issue. Such groups as Euraisa Youth Party and Euraisam , are the real problem. The Eurasian ideology draws an entirely different lesson from the twentieth century. Founded around 2001 by the Russian political scientist Aleksandr Dugin, it proposes the realization of National Bolshevism. Rather than rejecting totalitarian ideologies, Eurasianism calls upon politicians of the twenty-first century to draw what is useful from both fascism and Stalinism. Dugin’s major work, The Foundations of Geopolitics, published in 1997, follows closely the ideas of Carl Schmitt, the leading Nazi political theorist. Eurasianism is not only the ideological source of the Eurasian Union, it is also the creed of a number of people in the Putin administration, and the moving force of a rather active far-right Russian youth movement. For years Dugin has openly supported the division and colonization of Ukraine.

Mar 07, 2014 10:21am EST  --  Report as abuse

“European Union leaders and Obama denounced the referendum as illegitimate, saying it would violate Ukraine’s constitution.” If anyone would know about constitutional violations it would be Obama. He and his lackey Holder have been constantly violating the United States Constitution ever since he set foot in the White House.

Mar 07, 2014 10:23am EST  --  Report as abuse
paintcan wrote:

Take a look on Google earth of Ukraine and Crimea. It was the equivalent to Russia of the area between the Mississippi to the desserts east of the rockies. Ukraine uses the land far more intensively while the bread basket of the USA uses circular fields irrigated by a rolling boom pivoted at the center for irrigation. It leaves a lot of waste area in the interstices of the circles. Crimea seems to show more of that type of modern agriculture than anywhere else in Ukraine and Savastapol is the largest city. I didn’t look for Kiev. If you look closely and know how to read structures for type of use you see a pretty diffuse distribution of industry – what look like mine heads. It does not look like an impoverished developing country and appears to have comfortable and well-planned urban development that is also very compact. That is something this country can’t seem to do at all. This parasite of a country would cover square miles of it with suburban overpriced ticky tacky rattle traps and money pits absolutely dependent on the private automobile to do even simple errands. They are all surrounded by farm fields and in one city I saw houses lined city street with large agricultural acreage attacked as the back yards and those were backed by immense fields. In other words collective farms (what would otherwise be agribusiness here) is augmented by mom and pop truck farms of substantial area. You never see that here. Ukraine is rich in mineral resources. Amazingly – there is hardly any unused open space or woodland, at last in those areas north and west and in the Crimea. I’ve never seen it but it looks like Ukraine is endless fields like the prairie states. It tells you that political attitudes probably run with about as much sophistication as you would find in the midwest. That is pretty basic “God and country” stuff with walloping doses of ethnic chauvinism and not many people are highly educated.

Ukraine walked off with the Russian bread basket that had been part of that country since the Middle ages. If that had happened to this country, our economy and security would have collapsed overnight, as it did for the Russians.

It is not something this country would have tolerated. But we are a very tame and docile population under the constant control of government sponsored security apparatus that would make the KBG look like amateurs. I see people in Boston who seem to be afraid to cross at an intersection when there is no vehicular traffic to interfere with their own movements. My God the atmosphere is sickening compared to 30 years ago. Every time I go down there I think they are all on their Meds. They probably are.

Neither Europe nor the US has room for agricultural expansion and the cost of production is rising as it is in all the developed countries. Their own populations are becoming too expensive to employ for basic needs like food and raw materials. They need the low cost labor and land of Ukraine and the agricultural lebensraum for their own domestic needs.

This is not an argument over autonomy and territorial integrity or even good government. It is another fight for resources and the USA and Europe want the Ukraine breadbasket in their own pocket.

That means the population of Ukraine is actually expendable. The cities are few and far between. The country is covered with dense-packed agricultural fields with relatively small cities. Outright civil war in every city won’t damage the mines or the fields – except for the loss of, no doubt, older mine head facilities. And wasn’t that how Iraq was touted? We brought improved infrastructure (especially the wells) and milked the civic improvements as the spoils of war granted to domestic contractors. The Iraqis got a domestic insurgency by design (read Fiasco) along with constant bombing by domestic actors to keep them all off balance. Ukraine could easily be another Syria and let to the greed and spoiled appetites of the armchair warriors and so called “friends of democracy” that infest these pages, none of which are likely to so much as scratch themselves over the issue. That is always something the less developed are expected to do.

Under all the glitter, technological sophistication and glamour of the developed countries, there is still the need for the food and raw materials as cheaply obtained as possible and that is Ukraine. If my comments are too light before – it’s because the media is a hopeless denier of the obvious. They deny the intensity of the need that everyone has for what Ukraine is. It is chronic, terrible and the Ukranians will be the part of the argument that is most easily replaced by anyone else, from anywhere else. Putin and the Russians aren’t stupid. A lot of us are.

It will be terrible for them and they should do anything possible to smooth the tensions or a bulldozer of world appetite will bury them or force them to bury themselves. Neither Europe nor the USA are such happy lands they can afford rising food prices. It would only aggravate their own derivative economies, disparities of wealth and opportunity and make life unstable for all of them.

If all out war breaks out in Ukraine – the Ukrainians can count on being refugees and/or dead. Their human value isn’t nearly as important as the territory they occupy. This is a world that puts on a glittering show of human achievement and buries it’s true nature and ruthless appetites under the euphemisms and double talk of politicians and diplomats, most of whom live with what can be called “acceptable corruption”. This is a world that is rapidly turning into one where the well heal feel that it is almost their divine right to dominate the less so. All the talk of political autonomy is a lie. That is the least important aspect of the situation.

UKRAINE – You’re toast! And many on Wall Street, the city, and in Germany will, no doubt, hoist a Champaign glass to their insight and ruthless investments over your dead bodies.

Mar 07, 2014 10:36am EST  --  Report as abuse

If we really want to hit Russia where it hurts, we need to continue to do what we are doing – disrupt them economically. One thing we haven’t done, which would be more disruptive than anything to them, is to lower our natural gas prices and crank up the exports to the EU into overdrive. Russia is heavily reliant on the EU purchasing their energy, and if we usurped Russia as their primary supplier, it would be incredibly damaging to Russia, something Putin couldn’t afford to ignore.

Mar 07, 2014 10:56am EST  --  Report as abuse
UauS wrote:

Totalitarianism is cancer of human race. Putin is a international mafioso/terrorist #1.
All the good will people throughout the world must unite to stop totalitarianism today, for tomorrow it may be too late.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55izx6rbCqg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJb5PfZxfXI
(No translation necessary)

Mar 07, 2014 11:09am EST  --  Report as abuse
Fromkin wrote:

Who the people of Crimea voted for in the last elestions? Are they OK now to be ruled by skinheads and neo nazis imposed to Ukraine by NATO nations?

What if the 2.000.000 crimeans really want Russia’s protection?

What if they truely do not trust the US government after seeing its actions during the last 10 years?

If I was Crimean I’d only trust Russia after seeing the madmen of Maidan in action. Had Russia not intervened, crimea would be burning from burnt tires and molotovs by now.

That would have been just fine for Westerners coup plotters. Yurosh would have ordered the military barracks to open their doors to neo nazi “revolutionaries”. The corporate media would have inundated us with more propaganda about peaceful(neo nazi) protesters against Russian invaders.

I’d not even trust the UN which takes orders from Victoria Nuland and Samantha Power, who takes orders from the “powerful tribe” bacause of her son’s ancestry as she claimed.

Mar 07, 2014 11:12am EST  --  Report as abuse
WestFlorida wrote:

Who is next? Latvia? Lithuania? They have Russian populations also. Will they also call for “help”?

Mar 07, 2014 11:17am EST  --  Report as abuse
JPHR wrote:

Another take on this:
http://www.opednews.com/articles/1/What-Neocons-Want-from-Ukr-by-Robert-Parry-Crisis_Iran_Neocons_Putin-140302-200.html

The most recent Kiev regime change seems a reiteration of the infamous 2003 Orange Revolution ending in infighting and widespread clientelism. Anyway leaders from that earlier version are now in 2014 joining up with ultra right elements and the oligarchs.

Weird to see EU partners with Russia investing serious money in Nordstream to avoid the Ukraine quagmire of corruption and also now supporting an interim goverment with such credentials.

Mar 07, 2014 11:21am EST  --  Report as abuse
UauS wrote:

Russia wants to destabilize Ukraine and the world? Well, I beleive we could reciprocate in Chechiya, Ossetia, etc.
Let Putin feel some burning heat within, maybe he will understand then.

Mar 07, 2014 11:21am EST  --  Report as abuse
Cyclops1968 wrote:

i recognize the referendum and believe that the Crimean is as Russian as Kosovo is Albanian….take that!

Mar 07, 2014 11:25am EST  --  Report as abuse
unionwv wrote:

If it’s OK for the majority of the population in Ukraine to cause Ukraine to become part of Russia, is it OK for the population of Southern California to cause it to be joined with Mexico?

There is serious talk of such in “radical” illegal immigrant circles and their population is increasing at a rate where my question might have to be taken seriously.

Mar 07, 2014 11:27am EST  --  Report as abuse
Imperial69 wrote:

I have no qualms with a nation becoming an empire again. Let’s face it we wouldn’t have a problem with Russia invading a country like Yemen if they could prove there are terrorists living there. The U.S. invaded Iraq and Afghanistan. The world does not like Russia occupying the Crimean Peninsula because they’re European (white). Personally if the age of Imperialism is coming back. The U.S. should move on this opportunity. China is basically taking over the Economy of Africa and the Middle East. The make free trade zones. Personally I think the European Union will stand down before they fight the Bear.

Mar 07, 2014 11:29am EST  --  Report as abuse
Rich_F wrote:

>>One thing we haven’t done, which would be more disruptive than anything to them, is to lower our natural gas prices and crank up the exports to the EU into overdrive

even if this was a viable approach you couldn’t do anything in this area until at least 2017 so it’s not going to be part of any short term resolution.

Mar 07, 2014 11:36am EST  --  Report as abuse
unionwv wrote:

I should add to my preceding commentary: The “Civil” War was fought by Lincoln to preserve the Union (Read the Gettysburg Address.).

Modern revisionist history emphasizes the issue of slavery, but that was not the instigating reason.

How far would Obama go to preserve our union? Not far, I’m afraid; coffee-house communists believe in “one world”.

Mar 07, 2014 11:36am EST  --  Report as abuse
UauS wrote:

JPHR wrote: “Weird to see EU partners with Russia investing serious money in Nordstream…”

Putin bought Europe. You don’t have to be a savvy PhD to understand that. It’s all online:

Gerhard Schröder ” is a German politician, and was Chancellor of Germany from 1998 to 2005…
He is currently the chairman of the board of Nord Stream AG”
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerhard_Schr%C3%B6der)

“Nord Stream AG is a consortium for construction and operation of the planned Nord Stream submarine pipeline between Vyborg in Russia and Greifswald in Germany…
The shareholders of Nord Stream AG are:[1][2]
Russia Gazprom – 51%”
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nord_Stream_AG)

Mar 07, 2014 11:36am EST  --  Report as abuse
slava_ukr wrote:

According to the latest polls in the Crimea in Russia want 41% of the population. Results of the referendum will be rigged. We know how “fair” elections are held in Russia.

Mar 07, 2014 11:39am EST  --  Report as abuse
AlkalineState wrote:

Christ, who cares? “Chernobyl Now Russian.”

Wasn’t it already? Some kind of fake autonomy for a while, didn’t work out and now the world is supposed to be freaking out? Let Russia have this sewer of a territory. It is fitting.

Mar 07, 2014 11:56am EST  --  Report as abuse
mils54 wrote:

I wish the President of the U.S would stop with the warnings, It makes us look like paper Tigers. Short of a huge military buildup of European and U.S forces and possible war, The Russians are in Ukraine to stay. Now if they were smart, A build up of coalition forces should be grouping along what will become a new and divided Ukraine……East/West. You know it’s comming so why get caught unprepared twice!. It would also apply pressure to the situation if the U.S sent Destroyers back into the Med off Syria and additional ground forces into Jordan…….Quietly, With no WARNINGS and or news bluster. Carrying a BIG STICK and less bluster will go much further when dealing with Russians…..Raw Power is what they respect not words!………..But does the U.S have the stomach?.

Mar 07, 2014 11:57am EST  --  Report as abuse
fretr454 wrote:

cold warwillbe rise once againafter two decades

Mar 07, 2014 12:15pm EST  --  Report as abuse
UauS wrote:

@AlkalineState: “sewer of a territory”? Crimea was a favorite vacation spot of all Soviet elite, and the Ukraine has one of the most fertile soil in the world.
But the biggest issue is that if allowed now, Putin will not stop there…

Mar 07, 2014 12:20pm EST  --  Report as abuse
SalesDuJour wrote:

Do Britain and the USA have the right to merge English speaking nations with their won because of language? How about the larger Latino community of Spanish speaking nations? Taking this premise one step further, do Spanish speaking nations have a right to challenge US sovereignty by taking over large Spanish speaking USA communities?

China’s neutral position is not neutral. Their non-position supports and encourages Russia’s move. This is no surprise. President Obama’s resolve is under challenge. Should the US not take a strong position with costly consequences to Russia, imperialist moves like this will escalate. The West must take a very strong position to prevent more of the same.

Mar 07, 2014 12:29pm EST  --  Report as abuse
MudCow wrote:

Bush Sr. responded to Iraqi invasion of Kuwait with a desert shield followed by a desert storm. Why not Obama respond to this with a snow shield and a snow storm ?

The US need not send own troops but merely call on coalition and NATO members to spearhead a defensive operation.

Mar 07, 2014 12:34pm EST  --  Report as abuse
BanglaFirst wrote:

West and the Free World must Unite against this naked aggression of the Russians in reference to Ukraine but then again the West is partly blame as the West did nothing when Russia occupied parts of Georgia,Israel occupied Palestine & Lebanon and India occupied Muslim lands in in Kashmir and Hyderabad! Come to think of it they are Muslim land or Muslim in majority or minority so I guess nothing will happen as Israel and India is proof so long you are powerful and Uncle Sam & West are too eager for trade & Commerce, little people & country will suffer!!

Mar 07, 2014 12:39pm EST  --  Report as abuse
desertlover wrote:

So I suppose, to Obamas way of thinking, if Texas wants to leave the States, then Russia can decide if Texas can or can’t. Mind your own business Obama !!

Mar 07, 2014 12:44pm EST  --  Report as abuse
ProEto wrote:

For the last phrase from “Tatiana” that everybody understands that this is occupation, I can say that it should have taken a while to find such a person in Crimea,or your journalist just made it up. Nearly all population of Crimea overwhelmingly support Russian troops and it is ludicrous to try to present it otherwise. Crimea is Russia, it always was. Western journalists were having very hard time finding any aggression or occupation signs there, and were getting quite creative lately, hence the irritation of locals. You people just cant comprehend the reality of that area, people TRULY do not want to be part of Ukraine, particularly the post-Maidan one.

Mar 07, 2014 12:45pm EST  --  Report as abuse
cautious123 wrote:

Talk about the pot calling the kettle black — the whole world now sees what a hypocrite Obama is, calling out Putin, even as Obama’s drones continue to kill innocent people in Yemen, Pakistan and Afghanistan. Obama should stop bowing to the murderous neocons, who want nothing but war, even though not one of them has ever fought in one. Get the neocons out of Washington so we might have at least a chance of diplomacy. As for Western journalists, once again they have proven that they are nothing more than a typing pool.

Mar 07, 2014 12:49pm EST  --  Report as abuse
AlkalineState wrote:

“Crimea was a favorite vacation spot of all Soviet elite.”

Soviet hot spot! Then I’m sure it is quite nice. A real Borat paradise :)

Well, they can have it. Keeps the vodka vomit out of the good parts of the world.

Mar 07, 2014 12:51pm EST  --  Report as abuse
ARJTurgot2 wrote:

This week the US stock market set new records. The markets have already discounted the Ukrainian risk. The EU has demonstrated they will not join the US in a new Cold War, and whatever happens will happen slowly and with calculation.

For every minute Putin is spending talking to Obama, he is spending two talking to Xi Jiang.

In the passed year we have done almost everything we can to trash our relationship with Angela Merkel. We have tapped her private phone, we have obnoxiously dismissed her EU leadership, and we are now trying to corner her by revealing details, out of context, from sensitive private confidential conversations with Obama.

Obama still hasn’t moved past community activist. He tried to lead the world, and it didn’t follow; he has no clue on what to do now.
I thought it was impossible for the US to fall lower than Bush II in diplomacy and world opinion. I was wrong.

Mar 07, 2014 1:02pm EST  --  Report as abuse
paintcan wrote:

@unionwv – It’s one world whether you like it or not. The planet isn’t getting larger and everyone can know everyone’s business and talk to each other. The people who still think states matter are the most delusional of all. Profits are global but the bills are still local.

@Alkaline – Stick to the wise cracks – Ukraine is not a sewer and your comment sounds like that of a frustrated brat. Doesn’t anyone know how to read a map or look at simple geography? There’s’ nothing so contemptible as hearing the faux dismissal of those frustrated in their ambitions.

@mils54 – Typical comments from a smug armchair killer that believes in push button power and dominion. The future should pull your plug. You’re a Nazi at heart (but hey were hardly a new idea in history) and it’s so much more subliminal than it used to be. It’s the Third Reich with happy faces and self help gratification. US military might with all the comforts of home,including hamburgers and pizza (the troops actually gained weight in Iraq) showers and cell phones and now murder by remote control. Do try to be honest about he affects of continuous warfare. What a comfy bunch of storm troopers they were when jobs at home were at a premium and the economy was taking another nose dive.

The developed world should always remember it represents the greatest draw of the planets resources and tends to use them the least wisely. And as with gluttons anywhere, it is the most dissatisfied with small portions. It leaves mountainous jakes after it has consumed whatever it touches. Salvation through gadgetry: the last issue of Foreign Affairs Journal mentioned “The Internet of Things”. I can turn my own light switches out, no thank you and certainly not for another bill and all the artificial obsolescence I am cajoled into floating with a credit card. It’s enough to make Marie Antoinette look like a house faru. It’s all getting a little too rarefied but what the hell else is there to do now?

If anyone should vacate the premises it is the over developed and the hyper appetitive and if there’s a God he probably agrees. History certainly teaches that lesson. The meek inherit the earth only because there are always so many more of them. I’m sure all our “own private animals” still remember how to replicate without all the fixins, but it’s such an emotional strain for our neurasthenic culture. Replacements can always be made for anyone, anywhere and probably will and so many billions can still do it on the cheap.

In a sensible world that wasn’t so murderously on the make, without so many shark investors willing to shear the sheep, Ukraine should never have left the Russian territories as they are so dependent on each other still and seem to share so much in common.

BTW – Mussorgsky would be weeping that “The Great Gates of Kiev” are no longer part of Russia. BTW – I’m not Russian, I just try to think like them once in a while but know I’m way out of date and the closest I can get is through the old music.

Mar 07, 2014 1:04pm EST  --  Report as abuse
dd606 wrote:

ProEto wrote: For the last phrase from “Tatiana” that everybody understands that this is occupation, I can say that it should have taken a while to find such a person in Crimea,or your journalist just made it up. Nearly all population of Crimea overwhelmingly support Russian troops and it is ludicrous to try to present it otherwise. Crimea is Russia, it always was.”

Don’t start confusing everybody with the truth… They don’t like that. How is this any different from anything else, when it comes to the media? They love turning everything into something it’s not, so they can feed the masses of hysterical nuts that want to whine about how some group of innocent people is allegedly being killed, or some area is being “occupied”. I love all the comments under this story, with people still talking s**t about the USA. lol Russian military moves into an area, and people are still talking about our ‘drones’ and a host of other nonsense, that has nothing to do with anything. Everything is still our fault, no matter what. And of course, that’s just how the media likes it.

Mar 07, 2014 1:05pm EST  --  Report as abuse
mjp1958 wrote:

Have to admit, Putin is very good at invading sovereign nations.
2008, Putin invaded Georgia, and there are still Russian troops illegally in that country.
2013, Putin invades Ukraine.
What sovereign country will be next? Poland? Estonia?

Mar 07, 2014 1:09pm EST  --  Report as abuse
paintcan wrote:

@mils54 – There’s no such thing as sending anything like troop build ups and carriers “quietly”. What time do you think you live?

In other words, you want to live with ignorance, so why waste your time reading the funny papers, like these? But does the U.S have the stomach?

This is a country with more fat asses and beer bellies than at any time in it’s history and that never seems to be balanced by bigger heads. Even brain power is be suborned by the illusion of gadget intelligence.

Mar 07, 2014 1:18pm EST  --  Report as abuse
AlkalineState wrote:

If Ukraine is so important to Russia, why did Russia let them leave 22 years ago? Now putin wants a do-over because some rock-and-roll girls made fun of his little weenie? “Ukraine is Russian. Mine!”

Seems like typical scatter-brained russian governing. What’s next, order Poland back into the Warsaw Pact and rush home to start the Warsaw Pact?

Mar 07, 2014 1:21pm EST  --  Report as abuse

mils54 wrote:
“It would also apply pressure to the situation if the U.S sent Destroyers back into the Med off Syria and additional ground forces into Jordan…….Quietly, With no WARNINGS and or news bluster. Carrying a BIG STICK and less bluster will go much further when dealing with Russians…..Raw Power is what they respect not words!”

BS, the world doesn’t care how big our sticks OR our d***s are, as evidenced by the international response to Bush strutting around the middle east, waving his in everyone’s face. Our belief that our military can and should solve all the problems everywhere we see fit is WHY we are hated by the rest of the world.

Building up our fleet would be a futile gesture unless we’re prepared to DO SOMETHING with it. If not, this would be a counter-productive move that would only weaken our credibility. So, are you prepared to go to war with Russia over Ukraine? Are our interests in that region important enough to make war a prudent decision?

If that’s what you think, I’m guessing you’re just another neocon armchair general who would not be making ANY sacrifices by such a move. You want our military service men and women, and their families, to be making all of the sacrifices just so you can feel like a tough guy. You need to toss that yellow bumper sticker of yours, because you DO NOT support the troops.

In this day and age, the “macho man” act is only revered by neanderthals like you. Cool, calculated intelligence is what is respected – not brute force. We need to use foresight, and not go blundering into war without a purpose or a plan to pay for it, like we did in Iraq – did you learn nothing from our mistakes? We need to hit Russia economically, not militarily. Putin will understand THAT, believe me, when internal chaos in his own country forces him to pull back.

Mar 07, 2014 1:30pm EST  --  Report as abuse
Galzu wrote:

Why should Americans care if the Russians dominate their own backyard? Honestly, the US colonizes and annexes countries all the time, and not even co located to us, like Iraq, Afganistan ect..The Crimera is directly bordering Russia, it belongs to them already really, its full of ethnic Russians who speak Russian and I’m sure that there are plenty of them that liked the Soviet Union days. The average American cannot name even our own 3 branches of government, yet we feel the need to dictate terms to countries half way across the globe???

Mar 07, 2014 1:44pm EST  --  Report as abuse
jameschen wrote:

Obama is either a hired gun by the capitalists/facists congregation, or an idiot ignorant of world history and geopolitics. Either way, he is relinguishing his duty to pursue the ultimate interests of the American people, I mean, the ordinary American people.

Mar 07, 2014 1:57pm EST  --  Report as abuse
carlmartel wrote:

President Putin is correct. President Yanukovich was not removed in a legal manner, so his request for Russian military aid is legal. US and EU aid for Kiev will go to Russia, and gas prices rise in April, so the West will pay Russia for EU gas and Kiev’s gas. The Russian offer to Yanukovich of $15 billion with lower gas prices and a rail link to sell Ukraine’s grain to China is far superior to the West’s offer of $15 billion with higher gas prices, austerity, and no rail link. Also, China adds infrastructure to improve the economies of its trade partners because it trades more with rich countries than with poor lands, so it makes improvements for future trade growth.

The West offers austerity, and riots in Greece, Spain, and other EU countries reveal how poorly that works. Compare the 0.3% EU GDP growth to Russia at 1.3% or China at 7.7%. In addition, Russia has $500 billion in foreign currency reserves, and China has $3.5 trillion. The two military allies in the SCO have $4 trillion in cash compared to the debts that exceed GDPs in the US and EU. As a former US Army veteran, I see no US and EU economic terms that can equal or exceed those from Russia and China, and the legal issues support Russia and not the US, EU, or Kiev.

Mar 07, 2014 1:58pm EST  --  Report as abuse
Whatsgoingon wrote:

“I don’t think the Russians will be allowed to take Crimea from us: you can’t behave like that to an independent state. We have the support of the whole world. But I think we are losing time. While the Russians are preparing, we are just talking.”

What’s an “independent state” when you need the “whole world” to back it up? Your fate is in your own hands and you need to keep fighting for it. People with big mouths drink too much Koolaid. Counting on them will be a costly mistake.

Mar 07, 2014 2:02pm EST  --  Report as abuse
KDLE wrote:

Please!!!, the only people who are afraid of our Community Organizer and Chief are the Republicans.

Mar 07, 2014 2:07pm EST  --  Report as abuse
unionwv wrote:

” The people who still think states matter are the most delusional of all.” – paintcan

So, Putin is “delusiona”l – right?

Mar 07, 2014 2:10pm EST  --  Report as abuse
Rich_F wrote:

military buildup as a show of force is not only a tired, antiquated tactic of yesteryear but it means nothing when the person behind it has proven to lack the teeth to bite (that’s obama in case you were wondering). just a waste of time but attempting to show everyone that you’re doing something which is really nothing.

Mar 07, 2014 2:24pm EST  --  Report as abuse
DominicPaz wrote:

“As a Canadian I’ve been hearing rumours abound that Quebec will be holding a referendum for separation as well. Although it would be silly of me to suggest that the two are the same, they do have their similarities.

My question is, if the pro-western governments see the Crimea referendum as illegal, would the Quebec one also be illegal? And if it is technically “illegal” would the US government still take the same hardline stance against a place much closer to home (both geographically and politically.)”

Would it be illegal if the US were to invade it, take control, then have a “free election” (wink wink) that they control in order to determine if the US could take ownership of it? Because THAT’S the case in Crimea … not the whitewashed, rainbows and unicorns version you just tried spinning.

Mar 07, 2014 2:31pm EST  --  Report as abuse
UauS wrote:

@AlkalineState: It is quite nice.
Just FYI: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yalta_Conference
Would they meet in a “sewer”?

Mar 07, 2014 2:36pm EST  --  Report as abuse
Fromkin wrote:

According to Reuters:

“Earlier this month, Tatars of Ukraine’s Crimea came out in their thousands, chanting Allahu Akbar in a show of loyalty to the new authorities in Kiev and opposition to separatist demands by the region’s Russian ethnic majority”

The truth can be found in Western media but you have to look for it like a nedddle in a haystack. The quote above can be found on Reuters’slides which say Crimeans Are In Minorities(slide 1/14)

So this is clear evidence that In Ukraine Islamists are allied to Neo nazis and were already in action in Crimea screaming Allah Akbahr and banning Russian language. They were certainly preparing to strike any dissident to their “revolution”

We all know the kinds of atrocities these words “Allah Akbahr” caused in Syria. There is no doubt that the people of Crimea were in clear and imminent danger and Russia saved them from being “Allah Akbahred” aka beheaded.

Mar 07, 2014 2:39pm EST  --  Report as abuse

Ukraine is a “bit” like Greece where people had gotten lazy and very relaxed even in a bad economy. It will be a hard nut to crack that mentality even if Bns were to be poured there. 33 Bns. in excess will not last 3 months and that tells you the enormity of the financial crisis this nation encounters. This nation is a bottomless pit and will have adverse financial effects on the lenders/donors. This crisis was very ill timed by the west and now they are paying the price for meddling externally into Russia’s neighbour.
Anyone on God’s green earth that thinks Russia will not prevail is really out to lunch.

Mar 07, 2014 2:49pm EST  --  Report as abuse
UauS wrote:

I guess, Putin should also invade the USA, Germany, other countries that have Russian-speaking folks who are “forced” not to speak Russian language.

Mar 07, 2014 3:15pm EST  --  Report as abuse
AlkalineState wrote:

@UaUs, Yalta Conference? That was before the place was down-wind of Chernobyl. Cute effort though :)

http://www.gerdludwig.com/recent-work/chernobyl-cleanup-no-end-in-sight/#id=album-9&num=content-5

Mar 07, 2014 3:20pm EST  --  Report as abuse
Crash866 wrote:

You voted…for this…twice…

Mar 07, 2014 3:25pm EST  --  Report as abuse
Crash866 wrote:

USAprag

“If Ukraine is so important to Russia, why did Russia let them leave 22 years ago? Now putin wants a do-over because some rock-and-roll girls made fun of his little weenie? “Ukraine is Russian. Mine!”

Seems like typical scatter-brained russian governing. What’s next, order Poland back into the Warsaw Pact and rush home to start the Warsaw Pact?”

Alkaline
“Soviet hot spot! Then I’m sure it is quite nice. A real Borat paradise :)

Well, they can have it. Keeps the vodka vomit out of the good parts of the world.”

You are just upset because your guy is being schooled by Putin…AGAIN!!! How do you like me now?!?!?

Mar 07, 2014 3:32pm EST  --  Report as abuse
teric wrote:

@USofRationality The only problem with economic sanctions to Russia is that it will hurt Europeans more than it would Russians, which in turn will hurt the worl’s economy, including us. That is why europe is not too fond of this idea, and any sanctions would be weak and symbolic. Europe’s economy is still fragile and all Russia has to do is turn off the gas to Europe, Russian oligarchs could move their billions invested in Europe, stop imports from Europe, etc.

The best thing we (America) can do is stay out of it and let the Ukranians decide what to do with their own country, and stop pretending we are Putins boss. Every time the Obama or Kerry threatened Putin about anything, Putin has continued diong whatever he wants, at least in his own backyard, and it makes us look like fools to the world.

The world is not unipolar anymore. America’s credibilty is declining, and BRIC countries are gradually gainig power in the international arena.

Mar 07, 2014 3:42pm EST  --  Report as abuse
teric wrote:

@USofRationality The only problem with economic sanctions to Russia is that it will hurt Europeans more than it would Russians, which in turn will hurt the worl’s economy, including us. That is why europe is not too fond of this idea, and any sanctions would be weak and symbolic. Europe’s economy is still fragile and all Russia has to do is turn off the gas to Europe, Russian oligarchs could move their billions invested in Europe, stop imports from Europe, etc.

The best thing we (America) can do is stay out of it and let the Ukranians decide what to do with their own country, and stop pretending we are Putins boss. Every time the Obama or Kerry threatened Putin about anything, Putin has continued diong whatever he wants, at least in his own backyard, and it makes us look like fools to the world.

The world is not unipolar anymore. America’s credibilty is declining, and BRIC countries are gradually gainig power in the international arena.

Mar 07, 2014 3:46pm EST  --  Report as abuse
Fromkin wrote:

These skinheads who seized power in Ukraine are lucky to have Russia as Ukraine’s neighbor, and not the US. One thing about the US is that It dont play when it comes to defending its interests.

If the US was in Russia’s position, facing threats from Crimea’s Islamists and Maidan neo nazis on its border, it would have bombed them already in the name of war on terror. And no country could dare talk about sanctions or international law or international monitors.

In Fellujah there was no need for international monitors when Iraqis were being carpet bombed with uranium depleted bombs.
In Afghanistan, people stopped celebrating weddings altogether because of the fear of an uninvited guest (drone) crushing the party.

Mar 07, 2014 4:20pm EST  --  Report as abuse
yellowjap wrote:

So, that is why China allowed first default, today.

Mar 07, 2014 4:32pm EST  --  Report as abuse
PortlandME wrote:

First point: Ukraine is a sovereign country. We have international laws/standards that addresses when another country invades a sovereign country. Simply, it is called an illegal action.

Second point: You right-wing supports and Ronald Reagan disciples are praising Putin, who was apart of the Soviet Union Evil Empire…the same Evil Empire Ronald Reagan fought against. You cannot believe the same thing at once. You cannot be praising Putin on one hand and be true followers of Ronald Reagan on the other hand. It is called hypocrisy.

Final point: either you support the rule of law,which most of you right wingers use against Obama regarding this country, or you are not for the rule of law in all instances. And, either you believe in the Reagan doctrine, which was against the practice of dictatorship or you are not. You can not have it both ways.

Putin is clearly violating international law, which most civilized countries adhere, and he is acting like a dictator.

We get it: you hate Obama. But to praise Putin and say that you stand for the rule of law and you are against dictatorship does not wash…in fact, it makes your arguments/comments null & void.

Mar 07, 2014 4:35pm EST  --  Report as abuse
buraot wrote:

Such hypocrisy from the US. The presence of Russia is welcomed by the Crimean people. Did people from Iraq and Afghanistan welcomed US and western military presence in their country??? And they are now the one talking about respecting international law???

Mar 07, 2014 4:40pm EST  --  Report as abuse
UauS wrote:

@AlkalineState: Chernobyl is actually farther away from Yalta than from Poland, Romania, Moldova and (surprise!) from Russia.
Anyway, how do they call “sewer” in Japanese? Fukushima?..

Mar 07, 2014 4:43pm EST  --  Report as abuse
OlenafromUkr wrote:

When in 1994 Ukraine gave up its nuclear weapons, US guaranteed its borders and safety. If US does not do it now no other country will give up its nuclear weapons, and those who did will buy it again. Since US will clearly demonstrate its inability to hold its word. THat is why US must intervene.

Mar 07, 2014 4:52pm EST  --  Report as abuse
one_some wrote:

Russia says that troops without insignia in Crimea are not Russian. Fine. Let’s play Russian game.
If troops are not Russian, neither Ukrainian, then what is the group of armed people without permission? They are terrorists. And they act as terrorists terrorising Ukainian troops, journalists and even OSCE’s and UN’s envoys. Recently they even mined gas pipeline on the Crimean isthmus.
NATO did a lot of anti-terrorist excersices with NATO Partnership members including Ukraine. Why shouldn’t they use their skills against REAL terrorist threat? Why shouldn’t they fight terrorists in Crimea, who are OFFICIALLY not Russian troops, so Russia does not care about them officially according to Putin.
In reality these troops without insignia in Crimea can be dealt with even by the Ukrainian army itself. It is not done only because they do not want bloodshed.
But having some NATO troops on board could be more challenging for Putin.
Putin himself made this trap saying that trrops are not Russian.
At least NATO can officially warn those troops that they can be dealt with as terrorists by NATO – to begin with.

Mar 07, 2014 5:05pm EST  --  Report as abuse
AlkalineState wrote:

Ukraine starts dating EU, Russia is like the ex-husband who follows them around yelling:

“You kol dis a mann? He is nussing!!!”

Hey Russia, your zipper is down. Oh and we planted some missiles in Siberia when you weren’t looking. See if you can find them :)

Mar 07, 2014 5:16pm EST  --  Report as abuse
xcanada2 wrote:

I think we in America are becoming increasingly aware that out government does not represent the democratic will of the 99%. Even several older ladies (my friends) at an actual tea party, no longer believe in President Obama or our one-dollar-one-vote system: Democrats or Republicans alike. Nor do they support our interventions in Ukraine.

Americans have expressed their unwillingness to go to war in Syria, and now in Ukraine. The corporation representatives, can bloviate all they want, but each of their ridiculous statements on so-called democracy and international law, just adds to the conviction of the 99% on how out of touch our rulers have become with us. So, go ahead, Obama, Reid, Nuland, Kerry, McCain, just make bigger fools of yourselves as fast as possible. Let’s get over the present 1% regime, faster the better.

It is pretty obvious to everybody that the US and EU have interfered in Ukraine, helped or directed the overthrowing of democratically elected government, and are now supporting this unelected government for their own 1%’s advantage. This is not democracy, and it doesn’t represent us.

On the other hand, if Crimea votes to join Russia, and does so, then this is democracy.

As far as US calling for their dubious interpretation of international law, give us a break!

After Crimea joins Russia, we will see who does better, the Crimeans or the rest of Ukraine. I would imagine that after the IMF/US/EU have instituted their austerity programs, and Russia justifiably charges full price for their gas rather than present 1/2 price, then eastern Ukraine will be begging for a connection with Russia. This will just create further problems for the West and for Western Ukraine.

On a related topic: the Western MSM have ignored the wiretapped conversation between EU Catherine Ashton and Estonia Foreign Minister Paet, that outside paramilitaries, possibly under control of present Ukrainian government officials, were may be responsible for Maidan snipers killing people on both sides of the conflict. Clearly this needs investigation, and Western MSM ignoring this new question is just further evidence of MSM subservience to our 1%, and ignoring the principles of truth and justice which the US 99% people believe in.

Mar 07, 2014 5:29pm EST  --  Report as abuse
pyanitsa wrote:

Sanctions will backfire, not merely boomerang.

Mar 07, 2014 5:30pm EST  --  Report as abuse
Bob9999 wrote:

“Senior Ukrainian opposition politician Yulia Tymoshenko, freed from prison after Yanukovich’s overthrow, met German Chancellor Angela Merkel in Dublin and appealed for immediate EU sanctions against Russia, warning that Crimea might otherwise slide into a guerrilla war.”

Yulia Tymoshenko must be a complete idiot. For Ukraine to sponsor a guerrilla war in the Crimean would be the very thing that will cause Russia to invade the rest of Ukraine. Guerrilla war against Russia in Crimea? Russian tanks in Kiev. Russian tanks in Kiev? Yulia Tymoskenko in Siberia.

Mar 07, 2014 5:33pm EST  --  Report as abuse
UauS wrote:

Those masked Russian troops showed true Putin’s face.

Mar 07, 2014 5:33pm EST  --  Report as abuse

Hey, anyone know where I can get a barrel of SPF 90,000,000? I have a feeling it’s gonna be needed within the next 6 months. I have just enough room in my nuke shelter for it…….

Mar 07, 2014 5:39pm EST  --  Report as abuse
pyanitsa wrote:

The West ridicules Russia’s assertion that the troops are self-defense forces.

Russia ridicules the West’s assertion that Svoboda overthrew the government without the West’s support and funding.

Mar 07, 2014 5:42pm EST  --  Report as abuse
Protester wrote:

The USSR, far stronger than Russia is today, lost the Cold War. Russia does not stand a chance in the long run if the West shows resolve. Time to explain to that wannabe Stalin what the real deal is. His little man syndrome is on full display, but he will not be able to stay in power as soon as the Russian people see that there are economic penalties to acting like a KGB thug outside of Russian borders. It is a matter of principle that the Western allies do what is necessary to put that little corrupt KGB thug back in his cage.

Mar 07, 2014 5:52pm EST  --  Report as abuse
JohnPombrio wrote:

It’s called a “land grab”. Wait until your neighboring country is weak and grab off a piece while they are struggling to recover. There is no “referendum” when there are foreign soldiers in country and control the key infrastructure. They vote and who tells them the results? Why, the foreign occupied newspapers, TV and radio stations of course.
Would it be the same if Quebec decided to “leave” Canada if US troops had taken over its airports, border crossings, military bases, and news? Would there even BE a referendum if Russian troops had not taken over Crimea?
No, Russia wants to take Crimea back, expand its navy military base there, and cut off Ukraine from any ties with the west. Ukraine would logically be Russia’s next land grab.

Mar 07, 2014 6:08pm EST  --  Report as abuse
beerpatzer wrote:

What do you think would USA do if Cuba decided to claim its right to the Guantanamo Bay area? Same idea…

Mar 07, 2014 6:21pm EST  --  Report as abuse

I’m sorry — I’m not a politician, or an economist, but if the main threat to the EU and Ukraine is primarily the threatened supply of LNG, why on earth wouldn’t this administration loosen regulations about the export of our LNG to the Ukraine and the EU and take that pivotal tool away from Russia. No.. this administration would rather make idle threats, rather than loosen restrictions on our development and distribution of LGN because it flies in the face of their “Green Initiatives”. Again, Obama, and his careless and clueless administration with no idea of how to lead in a crisis. Their idea is to substantially reduce our military preparedness during a period of international unrest unlike anything we’ve seen in decades. Brilliant Mr. President, Mr. Hagel, Mr. Kerry. Clueless blunderers.

Mar 07, 2014 6:30pm EST  --  Report as abuse

And Reuter’s — your policy of silencing voices with whom you disagree, is not in keeping with our constitution, or what is still the law in America. Your attempts to only publish comments which YOU deem politically correct, makes you part of the socialist mentality you apparently approve of and support.

Mar 07, 2014 6:34pm EST  --  Report as abuse
UauS wrote:

If you folks who support Putin’s invasion think that Ukraine is far, far away… you should think twice:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJb5PfZxfXI
(skip the first 45 sec.)

Mar 07, 2014 6:36pm EST  --  Report as abuse

It’s not a referendum as we think of it in the West. The ballot to be used in the referendum was released today by the pro-Russian government in Crimea, and the only two choices on it are “Yes, we’d like to become a part of Russia now” or “Yes, we’d like to become a part of Russia later.” “No” is literally not an option. Anyone who believes that a Russian-sponsored vote will be free and fair is either ignorant of the relevant history or delusional.

Mar 07, 2014 6:37pm EST  --  Report as abuse
carlmartel wrote:

Reuters has an article about a Ukrainian nationalist party, Svoboda, that holds 5 senior position in the new government. They started with the name Social Nationalists similar to the National Socialists in the Third Reich. The insignia was a “wolf’s angel” that only LOOKED like a swastika. They trace their origins to WWI soldiers, like Corporal Hitler in another country, but in WWII, they only “assisted” in killing jews, which made a tremendous difference to their victims.

In addition, they are described as not “overtly” anti-semitic, but Reinhard Heydrich, head of the SD section of the SS in the 1930′s and 1940′s was not “overtly” anti-semitic. He developed the phrases “Final Solution” for the gas chambers, “resettlement” for moving jews to the death camps, and many others designed to conceal Nazi Germany’s policy for jews. Ukrainians served in the German army and they also formed two Waffen SS divisions, so they have a long history of conservative ideas and actions. Now, the US government want to support the Ukrainian government that contains 5 of their members as senior ministers, including the Deputy Prime Minister, the number two man in the Kiev parliament.

The US and Russia fought against these same ideas in WWII, so it is bizarre that a US president who Ukraine’s Deputy Prime Minister would regard as a sub-human, would want to give Ukraine $1 billion. Maybe Obama learned how to grovel before the “master race” before he became president.

Mar 07, 2014 6:45pm EST  --  Report as abuse
CherokeeSam wrote:

I can remember when we still occupied Iraq whereby Joe Biden tried to push a referendum whereby Iraq be divided into three parts. Our meddling and hypocracy knows no bounds. I care about MY country. I could care less about Russia and Russian business, politics, problems or issues. Let’s take care of America ! Let the Russians take care of Russia.

Mar 07, 2014 6:59pm EST  --  Report as abuse
gunste wrote:

Is the Crimea the Sudetenland 76 years after that debacle?

Mar 07, 2014 7:34pm EST  --  Report as abuse
TomPiper wrote:

One thing I’ve learned in my 60 years is when someone talks tough they are trying to cover their weakness.

Mar 07, 2014 7:47pm EST  --  Report as abuse
lolzer wrote:

I’m for peppering Obama with a few RS-24′s.

Mar 07, 2014 7:53pm EST  --  Report as abuse
oxen wrote:

Russia needs to stand tall and firm, It is one of the very few nations still left that can help protect or stand side by side with the weaker nations to resist the over zealous NATO alliance’s hegemony. The notion that all sorts of Tom’s, Jack’s & Harry’s will be imposed in regions with help of nefarious armed protestors that shoot some of their own to frame opponents and cause chaos as they open a way for NATO exploitation must stop or be vehemently resisted across the globe.
Patternships should be peaceful. mutual and supported by the populations-not illegitimate imposed by regimes imposed by power of well funded West armed extremist mobs like those now in Kiev.

Mar 07, 2014 8:09pm EST  --  Report as abuse

The question is: Which country would most suffer if Western governments clamp down on Russia and impose and enforce sanctions on Russia and Putin’s cronies? Russia’s only leverage in this seems to be European dependence on Russian natural gas supplies. Yet if Russia halts gas supplies it would be defaulting on internatial contracts and agreements and cutting off the country’s primary source of income. Russia is totally dependent on its petroleum exports for government funding. Its upper class members of society rely on outside banking and visas for their children to attend schools in Europe and the United States. They suffer from brain drain as huge numbers of scientists and young people have chosen to leave the country. Russian industry and manufacturing is in horrible state of decline leaving the country’s economy in state of crisis should petroleum exports suffer serious errosion. Ask the good diplomat from Russian just who is going to experience the greater degree of discomfort from sanctions when viewed from this perspective. If an agile person throws a boomerang and it does indeed return he merely catches it and throws again leaving the target still in need of finding cover or face the results of being the victim of a boomerang successfully thrown.
What nation security interests does Crimea actually have for the U.S. ? Let Russia have it. Is it really in our interests to intervene in this?
Personally, I think we as a country spend entirely too much time and treasure responding the crises in other countries when we should be addressing all our domestic problems. The U.S. could very well have eliminated poverty in this country with mind boggling amount money spent in Iraq and Afghanistan. It borders on the ridiculous the lives and wealth we waste fighting all these questionable wars.

Mar 07, 2014 8:32pm EST  --  Report as abuse
Elizabeth5250 wrote:

Voting is the way to chose the path taken. However, in this case will the voting be unbiased, unhindered, fair, and not seemingly forced?

Things are getting very tight and one miscalculation can and will lead to a shooting war. The question is will it be limited locally or spread to include a larger more dangerous level.

Mar 07, 2014 8:59pm EST  --  Report as abuse
seafloor wrote:

The parliament in Kiev is not legitimated by the voters. The former governing party disappeared after the political cleansing into thin air. Instead there is timoschenko, the most greedy goddess of corruption herself, back in charge with her marionettes. There is nobody, who represents russian-friendly Ukrainians. Even worse the new Nazi regime started to discriminate against the russian-friendly population immidiatly. Why don’t you expect from Russia after the breach of contract (Feb. 21th) between the former, corrupt, russian-friendly regime and the new, extreme corrupt, us-friendly Nazi regime, what you would expect from the USA? The US way of life seems to be directed by pocket money nowadays.

Mar 07, 2014 9:23pm EST  --  Report as abuse
J-Bone wrote:

Let me tell you something about that little dictator. I would very easily kick his ass.

Mar 07, 2014 9:54pm EST  --  Report as abuse
SKYDRIFTER wrote:

Morality judgments aside, so far there hasn’t been any proposed ‘effective’ tactic to change or reverse Putin’s course. Putin is the bully who could care less about name-calling. He’s blocking the doorway; and nobody can “make” him move.

Putin is correct about the proposed “Western” sanctions; they will almost immediately become ineffective, against Putin’s version of the same. Alternately, Putin has far more leverage against the “West;” which is clearly being held in reserve.

As one case in point, it’s probable that the U.S. (NATO) is highly dependent upon Russia/Putin for both airspace and land routes for the withdrawal of NATO troops from Afghanistan. With no guarantees of a “peaceful” withdrawal, the U.S., in particular, may quickly become desperate for Putin’s cooperation – as will all of the NATO countries.

In the background, Putin hasn’t forgotten that it was the U.S. who facilitated the humiliating withdrawal of Russian troops from Afghanistan – also pushing the Soviet Union into bankruptcy; leading to the collapse of the Soviet Union. And, Putin remains a die-hard “Soviet.”

Putin is a political pragmatist, but he’s also famous for having a hot temper. If Putin decides on any format of “revenge,” he has all the necessary means at his disposal. Putin is also famous for being cunning; unafraid to exercise dynamic patience. Obama may as well be playing chess against an opponent with a photographic memory.

Two of Putin’s biggest ‘clubs’ are the EU gas supply and Russian-Western space cooperation. Just delays could be painful to the West; let alone an outright “nyet!” Just the ‘timing’ of Putin’s reactions could be brutal. The SpaceX corporation can ‘supply’ the Space Station; but how are American crew members, in particular, going to be transported; without Putin’s blessing and cooperation? About those visa restrictions ….

Right now, Putin doesn’t have any motivation for compromise on the “Ukraine Crisis.” He only needs to wait for that which is predictable to happen – or not happen.

Ukraine is presently a bankrupt country without a functioning government; with little chance of a Western bailout actually occurring. Worse, there are reports of infighting amongst the three major Ukraine political groups. Ultimately, it’s far more likely that only Russia will be willing able to assist Ukraine; but, at Putin’s pleasure.

In the interim, Putin is waiting to remind the West that any harm caused to Russia will be passed on to Ukraine. Without Putin’s “recognition” of a new government, Ukraine will continue to suffer. And, Ukraine still has a huge debt to pay to Western interests. Financially, the longer this crisis lasts, the worse it is for the West, as well. Unless Ukraine becomes a benchmark Western rallying cry – comparable to the “Berlin Airlift” – with a huge ‘donation’ to Ukraine; Putin only has to ‘manage’ his desired outcome.

In the periphery, any significant Western action or reaction is “expensive;” politically and monetarily. Putin is quite certain that “Cold War II” isn’t affordable to the West; just in terms of the required military posturing. Conversely, if “Cold War II” became a reality; Russia doesn’t need to change more than its “attitude” and policies toward the West.

Regardless, the “Ukraine Crisis” properly remains a matter for the EU and the UN. Political PR bluster aside, Obama and the Gang really don’t have a horse in this race. Even by way of “charity,” the U.S. coffers are too empty to make a difference to Ukraine.

However, if Putin wins this fight, the U.S. is assured to be very firmly tagged as a has-been ‘friend to the world.’ All of Obama and Kerry’s rhetoric will backfire on the USA.

In the distance, the assured return of the Taliban in Afghanistan will emphasize the lack of the U.S. ability and resolve, as being the reality. In that same shadow, the future of Iraq is increasingly uncertain. Should Iraq also collapse, the impact on all of the U.S. combat veterans and the American public will be devastating. This “Ukraine Crisis” may only serve to prod Putin into using that “club;” timing being everything. The U.S. November elections may well hinge on Putin’s discretion; and 2016 will “happen” all too quickly. Hillary is already choosing her few words very carefully.

Mar 07, 2014 10:30pm EST  --  Report as abuse
igorbobr wrote:

Regardless of current and evolving East-West standoffs,the West’s threatened sanctions,Russia’s “boomerang” warnings and,”Referendum” chest-thumping by some in Crimea – Ukraine should avail itself of the current opportunity to simply sell the colonial,”poison pill” of Crimea to Russia for some appropriately hefty sum; using some of the proceeds to rebuild its military (including the nuclear weapon arsenal it so naively gave up in exchange for a combination of pocket change and Budapest-Memo/scrap-paper ,”security guarantees” from the West). The remaining proceeds should then be used for constructing an Israeli-type ditch, wall and sensor barrier between Ukraine and Crimea – to preclude anyone’s creeping back into Ukraine after a taste of life in Putin’s paradise.

As part of the proposed sale, Ukraine should also insure that the numerous Tatar/Ukrainian communities of Crimea continue to enjoy the same state-sanctioned and financed language, cultural, institutional and organizational rights and privileges currently enjoyed by ethnic Russians throughout Ukraine – including the right to dual-loyalty citizenship and passports.

Finally, the right of referendum for choice of citizenship, re-union with the ,”Motherland” and some albeit-belated post-imperial redrawing of Eurasian borders – should be provided to the 5+ million ethnic Ukrainians currently stranded in Ukraine’s ,”near abroad” provinces of Voronezh, Kursk, Rostov and the Kuban-Krasnodar in Russia.

After all, where is it written that it’s only,”Mother Russia’s” deliberately misplaced children who warrant human rights, security and fraternal defense? Surely the millions of ethnic Ukrainians currently orphaned in Russia are worthy of the same considerations and options – as are the ,”federated” peoples of Russia’s own Daghestan, Chechnya, Tataristan, etc.

I/S Bobr

Mar 07, 2014 11:29pm EST  --  Report as abuse
thomaswolfe wrote:

Choice under Putin Yes or Yes later but you can not choose No

Two choices in Crimean referendum: yes and yes
Print version
March 7, 2014, 7:04 p.m. | Ukraine — by Katya Gorchinskaya

The ballot for March 16 Crimean referendum gives two choices, to join Russia or become independent.
© Kyiv Post

Katya Gorchinskaya

Editor

Voters in Ukraine’s Russian-occupied Crimea who vote in the March 16 referendum have two choices – join Russia immediately or declare independence and then join Russia.

So the choices are “yes, now” or “yes, later.”

Voting “no” is not an option.

The lack of choice wouldn’t surprise anyone familiar with how Soviet or Russian elections are run.

The Crimean parliament released the design of the ballot that will be used for the referendum, which will be taking place as thousands of Russian soldiers are in control and – it appears – Russian President Vladimir Putin is calling the shots..

Acting President Oleksandr Turchynov has annulled the referendum as illegal and unconstitutional, but the pro-Kremlin Crimean authorities who took power on Feb. 27 do not recognize the legitimacy of central government and have said they will proceed with the vote.

The ballot asks two questions and leaves no option for a “no” vote. Voters are simply asked to check one of two boxes:

Do you support joining Crimea with the Russian Federation as a subject of Russian Federation?

And:

Do you support restoration of 1992 Crimean Constitution and Crimea’s status as a part of Ukraine?

That Constitution declares that Crimea is an independent state.

The questions are written in Russian, Ukrainian and Crimean Tatar, the three most widely spoken languages on the peninsula, and the paper carries a warning in all three languages that marking both options will invalidate the ballot.

Volodymyr Yavorkiy, a member of the Kharkiv Human Rights Group, says that not only is the referendum completely illegal, the ballot for it doesn’t stand up to any criticism.

“There is no option for ‘no,’ they are not counting the number of votes, but rather which one of the options gets more votes,” says Yavorskiy. “Moreover, the first question is about Crimea joining Russia, the second – about it declaring independence and joining Russia. In other words, there is no difference.”

He says with no choice available, “it’s clear what the result will be.”

Mykhailo Malyshev, head of the Crimean parliament’s commission on referendum, said the election will have 1,250 polling stations equipped with web cameras for the vote.

“We have a desire and preparations for installing web cameras at polling stations. They can play a great role during the vote, and if technically it is possible, the web cameras will be installed,” UNIAN news agency quoted him as saying.

Malyshev also said that 2.5 million ballots will be printed. However, according to the Central Election Commission data, as of Feb. 28, 2014 there were only just over 1.5 million voters in Crimea.

The Central Election Commission, which has also said that the Crimean referendum is illegitimate, took an emergency decision on March 6 to close off the state register to all authorities of the autonomy. In its ruling, the commission said it was doing it “to protect the database of the State register of voters from unsanctioned use of personal data and unsanctioned access and abuse of access.”

Kyiv Post deputy chief editor Katya Gorchinskaya can be reached at katya.gorchinskaya@gmail.com

Mar 08, 2014 1:56am EST  --  Report as abuse
niks0317 wrote:

If Russia is Ok with Crimeans deciding their fate through a referendum, will they accept a similar thing in Chechnya?

Mar 08, 2014 10:11am EST  --  Report as abuse
paintcan wrote:

@Skydrifter- “In the distance, the assured return of the Taliban in Afghanistan will emphasize the lack of the U.S. ability and resolve, as being the reality. In that same shadow, the future of Iraq is increasingly uncertain. Should Iraq also collapse”.

You have a crystal ball, you do!

Both are a very near certainty. There never was much of a resolve to fight in the ME. There was no draft or the invasions would have been even more unpopular then they were. It would have faced the prospect of drafting women. People are no longer rearing large families with sons to sacrifice. We would have had riots in the streets. The wars were managed to co-opt protest and to more carefully manage spin. But the outcome was, it made many apathetic about the last ten years and the wars have become almost automatic and out of sight for most. They are never a subject of conversation. Personal bankruptcy and collapse of the real estate market trumped the interest in the invasions.

But also don’t leave out the prospect that the resulting turmoil and bad feelings between the powers will led to even worse relations and conflicts between them. At it’s heart, on one hand, this country has become a spoiled brat. The Russians, on the other hand, seem to be used to the idea that they can survive massive setbacks in living memory and they are used to living less comfortably and a lot less autonomously.

And what’s the difference between using Nukes to settle a row in ten minutes rather than do it over ten years? The amount of physical destruction and loss of life in the long term conventional wars now could be seen as the “rational” excuse for using them, like they were preceding the invasion of Japan. An article appeared over 25 years ago in Foreign Affairs Journal that warned that Russia, with falling population and squeezed by loss of territory, might get panicked. And if Putin isn’t there to exert a stabilizing influence on the government (“dictatorially” or not and strong men are obvious targets of assassination, ala Julius Caesar), any government then might be a lot more aggressive and even stupid, then he is now.

The bugger is the human instinct for chauvinism, aggression and going for the kill. Just figure the worse case scenarios will lead the pack on any other actions a government can take that are less belligerent and, frankly, boring to hawks will be what’s left over if anything is left over. Nukes are the ultimate drone warfare and the warriors hardly have to get out of bed for it.

People never string up flags and bunting for peacetime (or not for long anyway) haven’t you noticed? They even do business as a type of warfare. And at the bottom of the last ten years – or at least a very unstable foundation – has been popular religious bigotry and chauvinism. Finer ideas were a luxury and not very substantial.

There is a line in the Gospels: “What father would give his child a serpent when he asks for an egg”. The Bible obviously didn’t know squat about herpetology.

Mar 08, 2014 10:36am EST  --  Report as abuse
Justiceworld wrote:

Hostile take over by Putin using military force…he is behaving like a child and very immature man to the world..we want peace and stability world wide..not corruption by Putin manners..

Mar 08, 2014 11:16am EST  --  Report as abuse
FreeOregon wrote:

How are “I’m your puppet” Arseny Yatseniuk or Yulia Tymoshenko any more legitimate than those pontificating in Crimea?

Have you thought about whether legitimacy is possible as long as the uS/EU and Russia take sides?

My understanding is that the people in Ukraine and Crimea are fed up with corruption, just as they are in the US, Europe, China and most other countries. They donot want ANYONE to lead them, and certainly not someone tainted by a career in politics or any relationships to anyone in any country taineted by politics.

Mar 08, 2014 2:08pm EST  --  Report as abuse
FreeOregon wrote:

How are “I’m your puppet” Arseny Yatseniuk or Yulia Tymoshenko any more legitimate than those pontificating in Crimea?

Have you thought about whether legitimacy is possible as long as the uS/EU and Russia take sides?

My understanding is that the people in Ukraine and Crimea are fed up with corruption, just as they are in the US, Europe, China and most other countries. They donot want ANYONE to lead them, and certainly not someone tainted by a career in politics or any relationships to anyone in any country taineted by politics.

Mar 08, 2014 2:11pm EST  --  Report as abuse
igorbobr wrote:

Regardless of anything else,Ukraine should avail itself of the current opportunity to simply sell the colonial,”poison pill” of Crimea to Russia for some appropriately hefty sum; using some of the proceeds to rebuild its military (including the nuclear weapon arsenal it so naively gave up in exchange for a combination of pocket change and Budapest-Memo/scrap-paper ,”security guarantees” from the West). The remaining proceeds should then be used for constructing an Israeli-type ditch, wall and sensor barrier between Ukraine and Crimea – to preclude anyone’s creeping back into Ukraine after a taste of life in Putin’s paradise.

As part of the proposed sale, Ukraine should also insure that the numerous Tatar/Ukrainian communities of Crimea continue to enjoy the same state-sanctioned and financed language, cultural, institutional and organizational rights and privileges currently enjoyed by ethnic Russians throughout Ukraine – including the right to dual-loyalty citizenship and passports.

Finally, the right of referendum for choice of citizenship, re-union with the ,”Motherland” and some albeit-belated post-imperial redrawing of Eurasian borders – should be provided to the 5+ million ethnic Ukrainians currently stranded in Ukraine’s ,”near abroad” provinces of Voronezh, Kursk, Rostov and the Kuban-Krasnodar in Russia.

After all, where is it written that only,”Mother Russia’s” deliberately misplaced children warrant human rights, security and fraternal defense? Surely the millions of ethnic Ukrainians currently orphaned in Russia are worthy of the same considerations and options (not to mention the peoples of Chechnya, Dagestan, Tataristan, etc.).

I/S Bobr

Mar 08, 2014 2:58pm EST  --  Report as abuse
707 wrote:

Europe better bestir themselves and place strict sanctions on Russia else they risk facing all new nazi empire this time armed with nuclear weaponry. It will happen sooner then they think.

Mar 08, 2014 3:19pm EST  --  Report as abuse
17plusOne wrote:

President Putin judos his free nation to safety by flipping rioters off their feet. Then they can stand back up, unharmed, calmer, more educated, and grateful for the dizzy topple that spun them away from future regrets. With ancient and modern martial arts, Putin leads his citizens to peaceful wildness, maximizing their freedom.

Mar 08, 2014 9:20pm EST  --  Report as abuse
17plusOne wrote:

President Putin judos his free nation to safety by flipping rioters off their feet. Then they can stand back up, unharmed, calmer, more educated, and grateful for the dizzy topple that spun them away from future regrets. With ancient and modern martial arts, Putin leads his citizens to peaceful wildness, maximizing their freedom.

Mar 08, 2014 9:20pm EST  --  Report as abuse
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