Investigators focus on foul play behind missing Malaysia plane: sources

Comments (33)
mauricio0599 wrote:

The articles talking about the 777 safety record keep saying 3 were killed in the SF crash. I thought they pretty clearly established that 2 were killed in the crash and 1 was killed by the fire department running over her which really isn’t killed in the crash.

Mar 13, 2014 9:21pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
jrg wrote:

If you hijack a plane and don’t fly it into a target, it means the target is outside of the flight radius.

It is the 787 that had the battery situation and cell phones have limited range, so no texts over open water. If one of the flight crew is the perpetrator there is no reason for the passengers to be alarmed.

But how do you hide a 777 and what to do with the passengers at the destination?

Totally conjecture…

Mar 13, 2014 9:39pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
XianSheng wrote:

Things just don’t add up here. It’s odd that no-one on board texted or messaged during this whole fiasco. Also, the Malaysian gvmt. is not to be trusted.
I think that the Malaysian gvmt. knows what happened, but is covering it up. Perhaps they took out the plane just to eliminate some rival on board. I really don’t know what happened. I’m just saying that I wouldn’t put it beyond them to do something like that.

Mar 13, 2014 9:43pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
beerpatzer wrote:

XianSheng: Have you ever tried to text someone while flying over an ocean? LOL

Mar 13, 2014 10:09pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
jrg wrote:

A 777 needs 8000 ft runway at maximum takeoff weight, but less passengers and luggage, a WWII landing strip for B-29′s would work. This one looks like about 6000 ft Dudhkundi Airfield, Jangal Khas, West Bengal, India

Also looks to be in flight radius.

Mar 13, 2014 10:17pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
XianSheng wrote:

beerpatzer: Can you read?
First, I said “text OR MESSAGE”, which includes phone calls.
Second, at 30,000 feet, mobile phones have greater range than on the ground. Also, some passengers may have had a satellite phone, which can be used anywhere.
Third, the plane might have gone down over land, with a lot more access to text or message.

Mar 13, 2014 10:26pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
zebra100 wrote:

Why Malaysia Airline and Boeing and Rolls-Royce were so stupid, so arrogant, so slow when they knew their were such a way, and even after received the original pin, they didn’t open that channel, pay or not, let those pins died away after hours, (according to this article, each hour one pin, they had 4-5 pins), now let 40 more ships and airplanes just wandering with no clue and all the families of victims in the dark? I have no clue what kind of professionalisms of these advance companies were doing or to damage?

Mar 13, 2014 11:00pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
AltonBob wrote:

Let’s go over what we know, or presume (at least):
- the plane continued operating for a period after vanishing from radar;
- planes are identified to radar by a device called a transponder;
- transponders are well-known and would be disabled by someone intending to make a plane “vanish”;
- after an hour in flight, it would have been possible to collect all communication devices from the passengers, particularly if the flight path made attempting calls difficult during that period;
- satellite phones would not work well because of the plane’s metal roof, unless the user was able to connect to a satellite through a window long enough to complete a call;
- if the plane did not crash, it would have to be hidden (a hangar>) to keep it from being spotted from the air;
- an uncrashed plane would have to land within about six to eight hours (this is an ER – extended range – aircraft);
- passengers aboard an intact aircraft would have to be contained to keep them from making outside contact.
So, if the plane did not crash, as circumstances make more likely as information accumulates, WHO would choose to hold it and WHERE would they choose to keep it? The operation would need to be planned in advance, with full control of the hiding place, and cooperation of the staff employed there. Aircraft have battery-powered locator beacons that transmit automatically in the event of a crash – clearly, this plane’s beacon was either disabled or destroyed.

Mar 14, 2014 1:32am EDT  --  Report as abuse
Mathew77 wrote:

I have a feeling that this MH730 is in Indian Ocean and it has not crashed. It has penetrated deep into the water and is inside the ocean. In short the Aeroplane is deep in the ocean but the people inside it are suffocated due to lack of oxygen.

Mar 14, 2014 2:23am EDT  --  Report as abuse
krahulrao wrote:

What if a giant UFO swallowed the whole plane?

Mar 14, 2014 2:55am EDT  --  Report as abuse
RobertHoward wrote:

AltonBob – the beacon has a limited range, especially underwater. If it crashed in the Andaman Sea or Indian Ocean, as appears more likely (assuming it did crash), then finding it will be much harder since that means the site is outside where it was last seen on radar.

Mar 14, 2014 3:48am EDT  --  Report as abuse
milkel wrote:

There seem to be Qs and Qs everywhere, and answers a rarity. The news above says the plane lost contact with ATC after about 30 mins from takeoff. Q – Just before the contact got cut, was there any signal/msg from the cockpit?
How much distance can a plane that has just taken off travel within 30 mins? Assuming a ground speed of say, 300 miles per hour, it was within about 150 miles radius from the airport. Q – Since 150 miles in the sea is not a big distance from the shore, and since there r likely to be many ships in high seas within that range, has anyone tried to enquire with the ships to check their radar signal recordings?
A highjack possibility cannot be ruled out, but then there wud hv been some message from the cockpit in the few mins that cud be available to the pilots, considering that the cockpits are these days electronically locked and the doors r bullet proof.
30 mins from takeoff the plane attains an altitude of about say 20,000 ft above sea level, if the plane was to have a technical fault, that much altitude wud certainly afford some time for the crew to arrange for emergency evacuation of at least some passengers, out of whom even a few remaining alive cannot be ruled out, are there any found? Moreover, the pilot would have tried to send some SOS to ground team in that case, but there is none such msg. That means the possibility of technical problem is remote.
That leaves 2 possibilities…….a highjack with connivance of the crew, in which case, the highjackers would have tried to contact authorities with their demands. Another possibility is a sudden blast in the fuel tanks which caused immediate disintegration of the aircraft not affording any time whatsoever to the crew for arranging rescue, or pilots to send SOS call. But then at least some of the debris would be seen floating?
This is all a BIG mystery.

Mar 14, 2014 4:22am EDT  --  Report as abuse
josit wrote:

The plane crashed deep in the Indian Ocean. Probably a pilot wanted to commit suicide in a way that wouldn’t be forgotten in a long time. Possibly a state (China?) sponsored hijacking to test the military capabilities of another country (e.g., what can the US’s spy satellite’s see?)

Mar 14, 2014 6:00am EDT  --  Report as abuse
SKYDRIFTER wrote:

Whether in terms of questions or answers; “weird” is giving way to “terrifying.”

Rationally, one would expect the airliner to eventually be found at the bottom of “some” ocean. It just doesn’t make good sense that there could be some format of the “Bermuda Triangle” off the Malaysian coast – unknown until now. Rationally it’s to be expected that given enough time and searching, the aircraft’s seabed location will be discovered. Thus, it’s not particularly unreasonable to expect the world to just be calm – and wait until then. After all, truly good people don’t “speculate” – right?

But, there is a limit to patience, when something such as Flight 370 “happens.” Already, too much time has passed, with nothing in the way of “facts” appearing; and far too many intelligent and pertinent questions hanging in the air, from all sources. Speculation, or otherwise, currently there are some really big and “strange” problems and issues which aren’t getting any better.

Call it “wild speculation,” “conspiracy theory” or “guess work;” but …..

Start with the prominently missing floating debris – seat cushions, life vests, baggage clothing, insulation, etc. Given the international search assets and efforts, which have been employed over the area covered thus far, it’s reasonable that there should at least be some measure of “suggestive” debris; if it existed. In the periphery …..

1. Too much information and too much “action” has been delayed, to reasonably be considered as being merely ‘coincidental.’ And, no one is yet making meaningful apologies; or offering acceptable explanations. (They have nothing in the way of otherwise “reasonably expected” information to work with.) Instead, there have been too many distracting/confusing/bewildering (“Red Herring”) reports being fielded. The copilot (and his captain) let a beautiful female passenger in the cockpit, way back when? Regulations aside, that’s not particularly uncommon; just another one of those “… don’t say anything” moments to break up cockpit en route boredom. So, why all the press? This was instantly beyond the industry norm of blaming the pilots; if at all possible.

2. The Malaysian military supposedly has possible “primary” radar data from a ‘strange’ location – but they have no primary radar data between the last known reported position of the aircraft, en route to ….. who knows where? What happened to that intermediate “primary” data? That doesn’t make a bit of sense – even if the aircraft went into a steep dive, due to a rapid decompression, for whatever reason. Rationally, there should have been SOME electronic emergency indication – at least a “mayday;” or a transponder emergency code. There should have been “something,” absent a local debris field. Or, was the aircraft ‘allowed’ to “…. get away?”

But, this “mysterious disappearance” scenario has been seen before; it just wasn’t “noticed.” Go back to 9/11.

3. When the airline industry “insider” information is closely examined from just the photographically documented information of 9/11, there are two 757s also “missing.” The “official accounts of the aircraft supposed to have ‘crashed’ at the Pentagon and Shanksville, Pennsylvania don’t make sense; just the opposite. Similarly, there was no true 9/11 radar “data” cited; just made-for-TV flight path depictions, for public consumption. Is this Malaysian 777 another such “missing airliner?” As with 9/11, there are no claims of responsibility; or “demands.” Is someone collecting “mystery airliners;” if so, why? Are they destined to “someday” appear as Kamikaze bombers; loaded with tens of thousands of pounds of high explosives – laced with radioactive nuclear waste?

4. As with the “usual” major mysteries, amidst the ‘known’ (and muddied) details, rumors and innuendos of Malaysian flight 370, there is already a lot of “plausible deniability” available.

5. Unfortunately, looking at Flight 370, at the moment, there is nothing “official” as to what ‘technology’ is/was actually aboard the Malaysian 777.

6. By way of speculation, if the aircraft was hijacked, one of the “smart” actions would be to pull the circuit breakers on all communications equipment; including the radios, transponder, “Aircraft Communications and Reporting System” (ACARS), cell phone ‘accommodation’ equipment, etc.

7. And, how could a “hijacker” possibly deal with all those passengers and flight attendants? (Simple, pull the circuit breaker on the passenger emergency oxygen system, put on a pilot’s oxygen mask, depressurize the aircraft for thirty minutes (max), re-pressurize the aircraft; then press onward – quietly.)

8. It’s possible that Rolls Royce had a totally independent data reporting system on board; intended to validate/diagnose the engine “health,” relative to the (FAA) requirement to continuously (electronically) certify each engine’s reliability for “Extended Over-water Operations” (ETOPS). Absent the required “service subscription/software;” it could just routinely “ping” (most likely the engine serial number.) just as described in the media. However, it would require competent “maintenance” savvy to know that the unique “engine data” reporting system existed, was installed on the aircraft – and how it actually operated.

9. In concert, if the “engine” reporting system operated independently of the “Aircraft Communications and Reporting System” (ACARS); pulling the ACARS circuit breaker wouldn’t stop the “engine” data (pings) from being transmitted – to the ignorance and ultimate dismay of any hijackers.

10. Assuming that the aircraft was factually hijacked, where would one successfully “hide” a jetliner from all the anticipated intelligence agencies (and their ‘spy’ satellites), in particular? (Try inside a hangar at a ‘controlled’ airport/airbase. The former U.S. Navy base at Subic Bay or Clark AFB; in the Philippines? Thailand? Taiwan? Speculating on a skilled pilot and the minimum need of a 6,000 foot (8,000+ preferred) runway (and an adequate hangar), how many possibilities are there?) In the case of 9/11, there were plenty of “closed” military bases available. Where did the two 9/11 757s actually end up? There’s a “real” mystery – still unsolved!

11. So, should any of these “wild imaginings” have any appreciable merit; who would have the ability to pull off something such as what is described above – and who would they answer to? What would compel the absence of claims of responsibility and “demands?”

As a contrast, the so-called 9/11 “truthers” and “conspiracy theorists/nuts” are commonly confronted with the question:

“Do you REALLY think that the obviously required number of people, in so many government agencies, could pull off 9/11; without SOMEONE opening their mouth?”

The appropriate response:

“The ABSOLUTE certainty is that bin Laden couldn’t have the ability to command the obvious number of people, in so many government agencies, which were required to set up and pull off 9/11; without SOMEONE opening their mouth. Eliminating the impossible, who else does that leave?”

Until “The Pentagon Papers” were leaked, who had a clue about the “truth” of the Viet Nam War? Currently, we have “Wikileaks” (Bradley Manning) and Edward Snowden. Yes, “really big secrets” have been – and can be – kept in America; for just long enough to get away with just about anything. “Plausible Assertion and Deniability” reliably stave off any crusades for truth, honor and justice. But, that’s always been true; at any place or point in history.

Quite obviously, the critical answers to Flight 370 are still waiting; it’s possible that the aircraft is resting on an ocean floor – somewhere. But, in the interim – in the face of so many unanswered rational questions – it’s still worth asking: “What if ….. .?

Too many desperate phones continue not to ring.

Mar 14, 2014 7:21am EDT  --  Report as abuse
IanHoder wrote:

It sounds like pilot suicide to me. If they’re flying the plane into the Indian ocean there is little chance that they meant to land anywhere. I hope I’m wrong though.

Mar 14, 2014 9:20am EDT  --  Report as abuse
MWisBest wrote:

Finally got confirmation on something I was thinking: The plane didn’t simply “disappear” from Malaysia’s military radar, it was just beyond its limits. The fact that Malaysia didn’t reveal this information when they disclosed it further alludes to the fact that they are trying to hide something here.

Mar 14, 2014 11:06am EDT  --  Report as abuse
p9tu wrote:

An unidentified radar signal heading away from the course to Beijing was picked up, but was it intercepted? I guess the Malaysian airforce could have scrambled a couple of MIG:s to verify.

Foul play – letting the captain deviate, then navigate on air beacons deliberately. A forced route? Or, the captain is a “look-alike”? The cabin at sleep, then landing on an unknown airstrip with a 777 where the perpetrators are waiting, refule. Lets hope this could be the case – for the families sake.

Mar 14, 2014 11:46am EDT  --  Report as abuse
gcf1965 wrote:

To those ridiculing the texting idea, many airlines offer in flight internet and repeater service for cellular. This is not at all unreasonable.

Mar 14, 2014 12:13pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
hotceller wrote:

The only cogent report I’ve heard since the jet went missing was early on when the pilot of another Maylaysian Air jet that was nearby said he recognized the ID ping of the jet and knew the pilot flying it. So he called the plane on radio but he didn’t recognize his friends voice, someone he had known for 15 years. He said there were muffled voices in the background in what sounded like an argument and then the radio went dead and the “pinger system” went dead shortly afterward. That sounds like a high-jacking or worse. But I haven’t heard that story again all week. Has it been discredited, or covered up by people not wanting to use the frightening “H” word?

Mar 14, 2014 1:00pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
dd606 wrote:

hotceller wrote: The only cogent report I’ve heard since the jet went missing was early on when the pilot of another Maylaysian Air jet that was nearby said he recognized the ID ping of the jet and knew the pilot flying it. ”

———

Where did you hear that? I’ve not seen that reported anywhere. If it was, I think it would be constantly reported since. Obviously that would be significant. Pilots from the same company do often talk on a designated company frequency, and the ADS system can show them who’s in the area.

Mar 14, 2014 1:21pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
jojoie wrote:

I suggest that the investigation start to look on the ground for the missing jetliner. It’s perfectly plausible that the aircraft was stolen and is now sitting on the tarmac at a remote airstrip somewhere in southern or western Asia. Pakistan, Afghanistan and eastern China are all possibilities along with any other country in the area ending in “stan”. I wouldn’t dismiss Indonesia as a possible location for the plane. Having a fully functional Boeing 777, transcontinental aircraft would be a valuable asset for any terrorist organization bent on delivering a nuclear weapon anywhere in the world.

Mar 14, 2014 1:54pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
Bob9999 wrote:

If I were watching a TV mystery, I would be thinking about the possibility that someone had prepared a landing strip on and island, and I would be waiting to see if the plane crashed into the ocean before it got to the landing strip. Also, I would be starting to think about the need to fly low to evade radar, and the that the fact one of the pilots had his own flight simulator might be a clue. (It might also be a red herring, and there is not reason to suspect the real pilot in this case, who appears to have been an exemplary professional.)

Mar 14, 2014 2:13pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
AlkalineState wrote:

Two Iranians board a plane with stolen passports and fake names. The plane is steered off-course toward the middle east and disappears somewhere.

The officials in charge want us to know….. these two facts are not related :)

Mar 14, 2014 3:36pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
mb56 wrote:

“To those ridiculing the texting idea, many airlines offer in flight internet and repeater service for cellular. This is not at all unreasonable.”
========
But wouldn’t you think that if someone turned off the transponder, they would also turn off any Internet/cellular services as well?

Mar 14, 2014 3:42pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
Normanium wrote:

This is starting to sound like some kind of a test run to prove out a scenario for other future purposes, whereby they were testing if/how long they could fly such an aircraft without detection after turning off the transponder and telemetry data. If so, it was a stunning success. In this age of high security in the airline business, how could such obvious weaknesses still exist in regards to tracking an aircraft?

Mar 14, 2014 3:43pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
AlkalineState wrote:

“Malaysia Promises It Will Find Malaysian Plane….”

Right after it finds its own ass.

Mar 14, 2014 4:22pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
Chazz wrote:

@AlkalineState wrote:
“Malaysia Promises It Will Find Malaysian Plane….”

Right after it finds its own ass.

LOL – Best post of the day!

Mar 14, 2014 6:11pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
hotceller wrote:

dd606, I read it on the internet. My ISP is Comcast so I have a limited selection of news sources (I’m an old retired neophyte on computers but I still have fair memory retention). The source could have been AP Headlines, Reuters Top News, or Reuters World News. What I have realized during the week is that a scenario can be put together with a reasonable reason/rationale/explanation for each hypothysis, to wit:
1. The second Maylay Air pilot’s story is correct.
2. The plane has been high-jacked by the the “strange voices” in
the cockpit.
3. The story has been squelched because:
a. The airline doesn’t want to frighten potential customers;
b. Neither the military nor the government want to admit that
their tracking capability is inferior.
4. Somebody(the USA) knows the plane turned and was heading to
the Indian Ocean and India was “asked” to join the search.
5. Somebody (possibly now the Maylay military, or the Indian
military) says the plane is flying only 200 ft above the water,
maybe preparing to land on an island in the Indian Ocean(?).
6. Notice that it was The White House that “suggested” the Indian
Ocean be searched. Not a dumb suggestion when you’ve got spy
satellites that could probably tell you the amount of fuel
the plane has left. But such detail can’t be told or the
Russians could learn our space capabilities and satellite
positioning.
7. So the game of “Dribs and Drabs” will continue with tiny
bits until,”Eureka, we found it!” just where we knew it was.

Mar 14, 2014 6:19pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
adamrussell wrote:

Why did air traffic control not raise an alarm immediately when the transponder went dead?

Mar 14, 2014 7:06pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
ChangB wrote:

They are like the 3 stooges up there on stage answering the questions.
Why have they not already searched the pilots and co pilots houses. Why have they not looked at the captains home flight simulator.

Stupid Stupid Stupid.

Mar 14, 2014 7:15pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
111Dave111 wrote:

Have they asked major international airports and military installations in the Indian Ocean if they could study their data received?
Like:
Sultan Iskandar Muda International Airport, Banda Aceh, Indonesia
Phuket International Airport, Thailand
Bandaranaike International Airport, Katunayake, Sri Lanka
Ibrahim Nasir International Airport, Male’ City, Maldives
Diego Garcia Airport, British Indian Ocean Territory
SSR International Airport, Plaine Magnien, Mauritius
Veer Savarkar International Airport, Nayagaon, Port Blair, Andaman Island, India
Cocos Islands Airport, West Island, Cocos (Keeling) Islands

Mar 14, 2014 7:20pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
111Dave111 wrote:

More Airports to check with:
Jandakot Airport, Jandakot WA, Australia
Chennai International Airport, India
Jagdalpur Airport, Hatkachora, Jagdalpur, Chhattisgarh, India
Yangon International Airport, Mingaladon, Myanmar (Burma)
Shah Amanat International Airport,South Patenga,Chittagong, Bangladesh

Mar 14, 2014 7:37pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
SKYDRIFTER wrote:

Humanity is begging. Flight 370 was a passenger flight; not a cargo flight. Flight 370 is far more than a profitable news media resource; or an armchair “investigator/intelligence” challenge.

Those who are terrified don’t have the luxury of patience; particularly those who have family on board Flight 370; whether passengers or flight crew. When things get that personal, there is a very reasonable expectation of the “best possible” and timely information to SOMEHOW be provided from all of the involved authorities/parties.

Just in the humane consideration of the families, by now someone should have the ability and responsibility of extracting “responsible” information from the various “turf war” players.

Right now, “the worst” has been accepted by the family members; they desperately need not just potentially morbid details; but also any supporting information surrounding the hope provided by the speculation that Flight 370 was hijacked. Is it the least bit possible that the occupants of Flight 370 could still be alive?

So far, too much supposedly “available” information isn’t being validated and clarified – or debunked. By now, for example, there should be an accurate description of how the engine data “pings” operated. Who would have expected to receive these? The airline? Boeing? Rolls Royce? No one; the U.S. satellite just happened to be able to ‘scrape’ this type of data – and did? What constitutes a data “ping,”, i.e., just the engine type and serial number? Did the engines operate with an independent data reporting transmitter, separate from the ACARS system? Did the ACARS system have satellite communication capability? If so, what data SHOULD have automatically been sent, en route – if any.

Did the airline have potentially effective anti-hijacking procedures, at all? (Any details won’t be provided, for “security” reasons.)

Did the aircraft have cell phone “relay” equipment installed?

If the commercial flight-mapping service is factually involved, what data did it operate with – and what was the designed “data source” of that information? ATC? Aircraft on-board GPS/Inertial and altitude data transmission equipment? What would it have taken to “end” that data-feed? Loss of a specific electrical power source, i.e., an engine failure? Loss of aircraft-satellite antenna alignment for a fixed period of time? What does the cited commercial flight path depiction data factually contain? One report said that the aircraft was last climbing through 35,000 feet. Another has the aircraft last cruising at 35,000 feet. Which is it?

While the question may be “extreme,” is the quoted commercial flight-mapping service the same company which provided the made-for-TV flight path depictions of the 9/11 aircraft? (No 9/11 military or FAA radar data was made available; but the flight-mapping company supposedly used FAA computer data to generate the flight path of the 9/11 aircraft. AND, no one seemed to have asked the most obvious 9/11 question of all. “Where’s the radar data?”)

If the Malaysian military has “primary” radar data suggesting that the aircraft was later “spotted” at an unusual location; why don’t they have prior radar data, covering Flight 370′s flight path between roughly the aircraft cruise altitude and the later ‘speculated’ location?

On other news feeds, Flight 370 supposedly reached 45,000 feet. Is that possible, given the aircraft’s expected weight? What is the source of that information; is it valid, questionable or bogus?

Why are so many “rumors” being thrown out, with no significant effort to validate or quash such rumors?

If the aircraft is “officially” suspected to have been hijacked, what efforts are being made to examine potential landing/crashing sites? (Assuming that it’s deemed at all prudent to get into that matter – for truly legitimate “security” reasons.)

However maddening, to be totally fair, if the “inner circle” conviction is that the aircraft was hijacked, there would be a limit as too how much can be said. In the interim, wild rumors could serve to give the bad-guys a false sense of security. It might be the case that “cruelty” is an unfortunate but necessary consequence.

Again, by way of speculation, there are enough parallels to the 9/11 aircraft hijackings to worry the global public. There was never any truly viable 9/11 evidence that a jetliner crashed at either the Pentagon; or Shanksville, Pennsylvania – versus the opposite. Where did those 9/11 aircraft end up? Potentially there are three airliners unaccounted for – with some really scary questions to be asked.

Whether or not anyone cares to discount such a notion as “raw speculation,” “insanity” or “conspiracy theory;” where are at least the “humane” information and answers, thus far?

As human nature goes, at least every concerned family member will be constantly formulating their own ideas, for better or worse; 24/7. However inconvenient to the various turf-war “commanders,” the family members are uniquely entitled to the best possible and ‘current’ information.

Mar 14, 2014 9:33pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
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