Violence erupts outside London but capital quiet

Comments (31)
Maxfusion wrote:

Isn’t socialism fun?

Aug 08, 2011 8:55pm EDT  --  Report as abuse

Britain’s AAA rating is probably going up in flames as riots spread from neighborho­od to neighborho­od and city to city.
Once it starts — rioting — and the population itself doesn’t take immediate action to halt it, chaos accomplish­es a critical mass which is difficult to control, especially if a country is caught in the midst of high unemployme­nt and growing economic recession fears.
America should be alarmed it could erupt in the USA just as quickly.

Aug 08, 2011 9:18pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
ladygoodman wrote:

This is what people resort to when they have no hope. Cutting educational assistance is only going to make recovery more difficult in the long run and is screwing an entire generation that has nothing to do with this global snafu.

Aug 09, 2011 4:33am EDT  --  Report as abuse
JamVee wrote:

Break out the water cannons and start tear gassing as soon as a crowd starts to form. Preemption, not reaction is the key!

Aug 09, 2011 9:49am EDT  --  Report as abuse
KimoLee wrote:

I don’t convey violence whatsoever, but disenfranchised young people have absolutely no political voice in Britain and America. The government consists of older politicians which care nothing for the state of younger generations. The people in power created a huge mess, and will retire fat and happy having satisfied their “peers.” What do young people have to look forward to? they are under a great deal of stress and facing the reality that they won’t have anything near the standard of living of their parents and grandparents.

Even if you go to college and graduate school you struggle because everything is so expensive, the dollar worthless, and employers want more for less. And then you are confronted with the fact the American government has spent what YOU paid into social security and medicare. They have basically stolen from you.

And it was ALL totally foreseeable. People saw it. They discussed it. And the politicians cared not one bit for younger generations. And so here we are. Older politicians, super greedy corporations, and boomers that totally intend to rip off younger generations are self-centered jerks. Wake up. Young people deserve better.

Aug 09, 2011 9:52am EDT  --  Report as abuse
Tiu wrote:

Capitalism is for the rich, unfortunately there are too many people who will never feels its benefits. With leaders like our we will only get more, and more of this type of thing unless they take an honest, fresh look at the structure of society. Too many people are w*nking on like the power structures of 1944 are still relevant.
Wakey wakey, although it’s probably too late…

http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/the-daily-cartoon-760940.html

Aug 09, 2011 9:54am EDT  --  Report as abuse
Joeaverager wrote:

Why are none of these western governments talking about tariffs to keep corporate production from moving to cheap labor Asian countries? Keep the factories at home so people have opportunities to work. Just because we can make widgets in China for 10 cents a dozen to sell at WalMart or the UK equivalent doesn’t mean we should. It still has higher potential hidden costs – and we’re seeing that today in the riots.

These riots could happen in many parts of the USA today. These people who riot have nothing to lose.

Now I’d argue that there are many ways a person could apply their waking hours constructively to help their families. Study – even self study at the free library. Gardens to help feed their families. Oddjobs. Take a job sweeping floors but get friendly with someone up the career ladder who can mentor them and help them build the skills that would enable that youth to apply for a better job. I’ve done all of these things in one form or fashion over the years and it helped me become a well paid engineer (though never paid enough ;) I paid my way through college and I made sure that I came away from every job I held big or small with new skills. I moved from one job to another under friendly terms so I could potentially come back if I wanted to.

Honestly a person isn’t going to get ahead in life lamenting how the world didn’t give them a golden opportunity. Get off the street corner and into a library and start reading. Or – join the military (like I did) and save some money. I did that for six years.

Aug 09, 2011 9:57am EDT  --  Report as abuse
seattlesh wrote:

Can the USA be far behind.

Aug 09, 2011 10:47am EDT  --  Report as abuse
anarcurt wrote:

@ Maxfusion: Looting is capitalism in it’s purist form. I take what I want and to hell with everyone else.

Aug 09, 2011 10:58am EDT  --  Report as abuse
cslockbo wrote:

Horrible and devastating madness. Blasphemy! These hooligans need to stop at once!

Aug 09, 2011 11:06am EDT  --  Report as abuse
pickaguitar wrote:

Wish this type of stuff would happen here in Texas. As time goes by I do get disgusted by the rich like it or not.

Signed,
Have Not

Aug 09, 2011 11:16am EDT  --  Report as abuse
pickaguitar wrote:

Praying this riot stuff will come to Texas!!! :)

Aug 09, 2011 11:17am EDT  --  Report as abuse
PKFA wrote:

@anacurt: Looting is definitely NOT capitalism.
Webster: Capitalism: “an economic system characterized by private or corporate ownership of capital goods, by investments that are determined by private decision, and by prices, production, and the distribution of goods that are determined mainly by competition in a free market.” Please note the operative words: “ownership”, “production”, “free”. It is the highest virtue where one person freely exchanges his or her value for that of another. One might even compare it to love. The definition of capitalism has been perverted in recent times by “progressive” media and educators. I suggest one read Ayn Rand for further clarification.

Aug 09, 2011 1:24pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
Adam_S wrote:

I don’t condone violence as a means to solve problems, but this is just ridiculous. If masses were truly protesting by taking to the streets, that would be one thing. This is done at night, by a specific demographic, and they are targeting shops and cars. The UK needs to put a stop to this, with guns if necessary. They are engaging in dangerous criminal behavior. The police need to treat them like the dangerous criminals they are.

Aug 09, 2011 1:43pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
Grant_X wrote:

We are one Tea Party member getting shot away from this right here.

Aug 09, 2011 1:46pm EDT  --  Report as abuse

pickaguitar,
why do you get disgusted with the rich?
because they succeed where you fail?
because they work during the day while you type nonsensical posts on a chatboard?
because they went out and accomplished something?
what is it?

Aug 09, 2011 2:02pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
Stupidscript wrote:

@PKFA: You were doing pretty good until your Ayn Rand reference. In fact, her vision of “capitalism” is virtually identical to anacurt’s definition … both believe in self-benefit over all else, and taking whatever steps the selfish person deems necessary, regardless of ethical, moral or legal issues, to get it. “Capitalism” has not been perverted … rather Rand’s vision of a “free market”, unencumbered by social issues, is what has never come to pass … and never should be allowed to come to pass. Rand was a selfish bitch who was both incompetent and emotionally unable to even consider how the policies she espoused would affect a nation. If you look to her for fiscal or social guidance, you’re looking in the wrong place.

Aug 09, 2011 3:25pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
jhardaway wrote:

The US is not far behind, in fact we had this occur already in Los Angeles in 92, and New Orleans in 05. This is a race riot…not hooligans, not disenfranchised youth, not guitar pickin’ Texans. I’d feel sorry for the Brits, but this is what you get when you take away peoples right to own firearms.

Aug 09, 2011 4:06pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
IntoTheTardis wrote:

If this can happen in the UK it can anywhere. Heaven help us all if the disenfranchised, poor, unemployed, or just plain nutty people in the USA reach their limit. We’re awash in guns of every size, caliber and description. It wouldn’t take much a spark to set some of our cities ablaze.

PS. You Brits have my heartfelt sympathy. I’m still peeved by that BP spill last summer, but I’ve got nothing at all against the average folk. Best of luck, all!

Aug 09, 2011 4:34pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
notoneofyou wrote:

@ActualTaxpayer

The have nots get disgusted by the waste, narcissism and greed of the haves in our society. Most of the rich in the western world did not reach there status without the financial support of their family. Only if you were orphaned at birth and raised by the system can you make the claim that only you have worked hard for what you have.

I come from a well to do family, and am fortunate enough to attend a university and have plans of earning a doctorate in science; however, I am not blind to the fact that without the financial support of my family I would not be in this position. Without that support I could easily do no better than a job flipping burgers or catching bullets.

Perhaps we should objectively analyze our socioeconomic status before we pass judgment on others for not liking their own.

Aug 09, 2011 4:49pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
onthelake wrote:

kimoloe

Try to be a whole lot less ignorant by making such statements as “. And then you are confronted with the fact the American government has spent what YOU paid into social security and medicare. They have basically stolen from you. ”

(1) Neither Social Security nor Mediacre is some savings account with your name on it for when you retire.

(2) Money paid in as payroll taxes by those working goes to their parents and grandparents who are retired. My grandparents paid in for and it went to their parents (born in 1890s and lived until the 1907s). My parents paid in and the money went to my grandparents and great-grandparents. I paid in and the money went to my parents and grandparents.

(3) Beginning in the 1970s workers paid in more than it would take to cover payments out to the 19070s retirees. This was – and is – the ONLY time that money was to be set aside to cover future Soc Sec obligations and it was done to deal with the large demographic of those born between 1945 – 1961/63.

And BTW, never in all of recorded history have the bottom 90 -95% ever been able to save enough all on their own to ‘retire.’ They either worked until they died or, if unable to work, were supported solely by their younger relatives or ended up in the county poorhous (read Charles DIckens for a description.)

Aug 09, 2011 4:51pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
someperson wrote:

@stupidscript You didn’t understand Ayn Rand, that much is clear. A valid interpretation of Rand would include that a truly intelligent self-interested person would do everything in his/her power to lift others because the truly self-interested person would be aware that survival, success and happiness can’t fully be achieved without community. Intelligent self-interest, which is what Rand promoted, should have a dominant selfless aspect. It is the UNintelligent self-interest that leads to the degradation of society on which you remark: theft, vandalism, promiscuity, substance abuse, etc. Lots of people doing thoughtless things. Entitlement programs pander to this sort of people.

No offense to this obviously injured group, but the unintelligent actions of self-interested youths on the streets in London is a good example of how capitalism is done wrong. Imagine the success they could have obtained if they had bound together and done something creative the last three days. That would have had a much more positive impact on their leaders than there current actions and helped lift their own spirits, whereas now they are in despair and prison. Kinda the same thing.

Not that I condone the actions of abusive government and big business. They aren’t following capitalistic values either.

Despite a good effort on her part, one of the big points Rand got wrong is the importance of God in a capitalistic society. I don’t believe intelligent (moral) self-interest would last long at all in a godless society, even for those who use ‘Atlas Shrugged’ as their bible. But the book does have some good truths which can augment an open minded reader. Her views on intelligent self-interest and capitalism are some.

I sure hope Britain can turn this around. There are a lot of good people there.

Aug 09, 2011 5:37pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
thewordguy wrote:

If all those folks protesting the lack of police coverage would stand up en masse to the kids in the street, that would help. For every rioter there are surely 100 non-rioters who could stand up to them. Locking the doors and hoping things will pass will not work. Sometimes freedom means taking a stand – and sometimes that means a physical stand. I’m not there so sure, it’s easy for me to say, but when I lived in the UK “up t’North,” I can guarantee I could get a group of mates together to slow down a bunch of kids.

Aug 09, 2011 5:49pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
samxv77 wrote:

Without learning why the riots came to be , I quickly summized that the real reason was the widening gap between the rich and poor and the built up frustrations of the working poor and vast unemployed in Britain . These are the real reasons behind the overthrow of the leaders/dictators in other countries of recent , stay tuned ! It’s soon coming to the United States . People have about had enough.

Aug 09, 2011 5:58pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
Stupidscript wrote:

@someperson: Not to completely hijack this thread … but Rand’s philosophy had no room at all for social welfare. Those who are not producers (of wealth) are useless in her vision of society. This relates to the troubles in the UK because the disparity between the haves and the have-nots leads to complete disrespect for the social order on both sides. Rand didn’t give a damn about the have-nots, believing them to be un-motivated, lazy and despicable. Like the upper-class in Britain, her contempt for the lower classes was both well-known and undisguised. Couple that perspective with her view that capitalist leaders should be allowed to run unfettered over the landscape (because they are “producers” whose output had “value” in her vision of society), stir in the passage of time and a relatively narrow regional scope, and you get what we see in Britain, today: Explosive reactions to relatively trivial, fleeting class-based issues.

Thoughtlessness is not only the purview of the rioters … theirs is a reaction to perceived damages caused by an upper-class that denies them self-respect and any hope of delivering their own “value” to their society. If Ayn Rand’s worldview were actually more popular (thank God it is not), we would see this type of eruption with much more frequently and with much more force. It is the actions of the upper-class (“ruling elite”) that have nurtured the seething resentment that is now driving the looting and general lawlessness we see on the news. Neither side is right, both are being selfish and thoughtless, and nobody can come out ahead in such a battle.

You gotta get past the pretty parts of Rand’s writing and dig into her true intent. “Atlas” may be her most popular work, but it is definitely not the one that best reflects her philosophy. “The Fountainhead” is much closer to her heart, and she didn’t bother to try to pretty it up for the masses like she did with “Atlas”. Also be sure to seek out her own writing regarding her philosophy, if you are really interested in what she intends.

Aug 09, 2011 6:36pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
BimboCabidog wrote:

Now we are witnessing bloody surreal scenes in one of the richest capitals of the world. Do they preface the story of the worst of times coming ahead on the heels of the capitalist turmoil churning around the globe?

Aug 09, 2011 6:40pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
Saturn2000 wrote:

Why the rioters in England are labeled as “criminals”, while the alike in Libya, Iran, Syria are labeled as “opposition”? Why NATO do not start to bomb London, France do not start shipment of weapons for the British opposition? Sarcasm of course, but good points to think of about. Also I want to point out, that based on my observations, a great portion of the people around the wold have lost their fate in the social and economical systems forced upon them, and they do not see any viable alternative. The lack of hope leads to desperation, as desperation leads to rebellion.

Aug 09, 2011 9:50pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
auger wrote:

The flash-mob mentality is spreading quickly, same as it is here in the US. Like any other ‘protest’, it can be corrupted by just a few and really deteriorate. Bad for law enforcement

Aug 09, 2011 9:51pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
2cartalkers wrote:

In Heaven:

The cooks are French,
The policemen are English,
The mechanics are German,
The lovers are Italian,
The bankers are Swiss.

In Hell:

The cooks are English,
The policemen are German,
The mechanics are French,
The lovers are Swiss,
The bankers are Italian.

Aug 09, 2011 10:25pm EDT  --  Report as abuse
Sinbad1 wrote:

Saturn2000
You are right but many will refuse to accept your logic.
The troubles in Egypt and Syria have exactly the same cause as the riots in England, poverty. The poverty was caused by shonky Wall Street deals and the US Government virtually forced Governments all over the world to pick up the tab and left the people of whole world a lot poorer.
Gold in Sacks carries on its quest for all of the worlds wealth hiding behind the skirts of the powerful USA unabated.

Why is it that Americans claim their democracy superior to other democracies and that their guns are to stop corrupt Governments, but do nothing to stop the corruption.

Aug 09, 2011 10:27pm EDT  --  Report as abuse

notoneofyou,
quaint little story.
which one of obama’s family helped him out again?
fairy tales are cute but not very accurate.

Aug 11, 2011 11:28am EDT  --  Report as abuse
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